Monday, November 20, 2006

In this crazy argument that Jesus is not The Truth...

In this crazy argument that Jesus is not The Truth... I find it funny that often these great men of faith taught the same thing... Yet... They are lifted up as great teachers.

I am not a Calvinist... Yet Spurgeon's word's resonate with me.

I submit that these men were not heretics... But to deny that Jesus is literally the Truth Incarnate... Is very much heretical.

I affirm and believe that Jesus was literally The Way, The Truth and The Life… which some deny! If I am wrong and a heretic… about teaching Truth being a Person and that Person being Jesus… then I am in very good company… here are a couple of other heretics who have taught this… for your consideration.

Enjoy the quotes!


C. H. Spurgeon's First Words at the Tabernacle:

I would propose that the subject of the ministry in this house, as long as this platform shall stand, and as long as this house shall be frequented by worshipper,

shall be the person of JESUS CHRIST.

I am never ashamed to avow my self a Calvinist; I do not hesitate to take the name of Baptist; but if I am asked what is my creed, I reply,"It is Jesus Christ.

My venerated predecessor, Dr. Gill, has left a Body of Divinity, admirable and excellent in its way; but the body of Divinity to which I would pin and bind myself for ever, God helping me, is not his system, or any other human treatise; but Christ Jesus, who is the sum and substance of the Gospel, who is in Himself all theology, the incarnation of every precious truth, the all glorious personal embodiment of the Way, the Truth, and the Life.

A.W Pink: In the Sermon on the Mount our Lord taught His disciples

"Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you and persecute you" (Matt. 5:44). Above all others Christ practised what He preached. Grace and truth came by Jesus Christ. He not only taught the truth but was Himself the truth incarnate. Said He, "I am the Way, the Truth and the Life" (John 14:6). So here on the Cross He perfectly exemplified His teaching of the mount. In all things He has left us an example.


ben2590 said...

Now, Iggy,
You know I never said that Jesus lied when he said he is the truth. Stop fibbing. I said it is a figurative statement. You make the point when you say he both taught the truth and was the truth.

I don't mind you disagreeing, but don't lie about what I said--something you seem to do to anyone who catches you.


ben2590 said...

Here you go--you quoted Spurgeon as saying: ...Christ Jesus, who is the sum and substance of the Gospel, who is in Himself all theology, the incarnation of every precious truth...

If Spurgeon meant that literally, he was calling Paul and Jude heretics, as you are when you claim this: But to deny that Jesus is literally the Truth Incarnate... Is very much heretical.

Paul said the gospel was a set of propositions in I Cor. 15. I can list them if you want. Jude said this: I felt the necessity to write to you appealing that you contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all handed down to the saints.

That which was handed down to the saints was the gospel (the faith). We do not have to fight to keep Jesus.

At any rate, this all began with your assertion that anything that abides must be alive. You still have not dealt with that nonsense.

What do you think Spurgeon meant when he said that Jesus is "all theology." Was that literal? And how can he be "all theology" and all these other things literally? Let's see-shepherd, door, way, light, truth, resurrection, etc.

He cannot be these literally. For instance resurrection is a process. A door is an object. Does a resurrection have hinges.

Another problem you have refused to deal with is if Jesus is literally a door, we are literally sheep. Do you have hooves? Or is this a figure?

And while we are passing around terms like heresy, you recently said Jesus is the Tao. That's heresy. The Tao is another thing you have probably not studied much. The Tao is the way to an impersonal fulfillment or enlightenment, not the way to the God of Israel.

Finally, how can a relativist (Emergent) call anyone a heretic?


iggy said...

I am not a "relativest" in the way you are saying... There is a form of relativism that is based on our own distorted corrupt view... which is known commonly as lies...

I did not teach Jesus is the Tao if you really even bothered to read... i taught Jesus is The creator and sustainer of all things and that if one believes in Taoism they can replace their impersonal religion... with the Person of Jesus Christ... you and Phil Perkins have twisted what I said... agian.. people ask me if you even bother reading what I write or if you just read the title and make up the rest!

I am intrigued by you denial that Jesus is literaly the Truth incarnate...

But whatever... It is more than just figurativly... if Jesus is THE REALITY... in contrast to the shadows in the OT. You are making Jesus the shadow of Truth... and that truth itself is higher than Jesus... I am not putting words in your mouth... often I ask questions for clarity as your view is way out there... i am trying to get you explain what you really mean... You seem to take that as twisting your words... again... not my intention...

I am done here on my blog with you... go back to your own and slander me more if you want...

be at peace,

ben2590 said...

You said, "I did not teach Jesus is the Tao..."

Actually you did. Why do you continue to lie at the drop of a hat? You even do so about things that you wrote publicly? Do you really thing everyone is so stupid? Do you not think this is possibly your teaching is so ignored? I see you have been at this for some time and I see that you have alway been this way. You don't even know what a verb is, and yet you lie and say that you do. But your use of the word itself is really way off. Why not just go back to school and get some education. Is there not a remedial program of some sort where you live? Then if you want, go to college. Just imagine where you could be if you had not wasted your life pretending like this. What if you had spent half of those years getting an education so you could actually do what you are now pretending so hard to do?

Any way, I felt compelled to expose your lie about the Tao thing on my site. You can go there or read it below:

Sometime ago, Carlos Shelton called Jesus the Tao in this statement, "Jesus… Who is the Tao Incarnate." Read that in this post:

Now he says he didn't. Just yesterday he said, "I did not teach Jesus is the Tao..." See this comment here:

The question is this: Why is it that Carlos Shelton continues to want to teach people about God, but cannot keep from lying about things that are publicly known? What kind of pathology is this? And why is he not brought under church discipline where he attends? Perhaps, they don't know. One has to wonder if in all of his life he actually is this dishonest. If so, he will end up in jail.


ben2590 said...

Your caught again. When I have time I will also post about you pretending to know something about English grammar. Just stop lying.

It will do you good. Get under a good pastor or spiritual mentor. I really doubt that you are saved. Saved people do not abide in known sin for years and years.
Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,

nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.

Those that stay in sin are not elect.

Praying for you,

iggy said...


Ben did you leave slanderers off the list above on purpose?

You obviously have something wrong with you...

My prayers are with you...

I apologize that I engaged in conversation again with you... I hoped for reconciliation, but you were just out to get me in something it will end here and now.

Say what you want... though I am not well educated and do not know Greek nor do I even claim to know how to diagram a sentence... you seem to to have no comprehension of context nor what you read.... thanks for posting the links... let the people decide.

I will continue to pray.

Let the spiritual bondage that holds be loosed, and the freedom of Christ be bound to your heart...
May Grace and Mercy be your very food...
May love of Christ compel you on to good works.
May the Kingdom of God be you final eternal Home...

Be blessed,

iggy said...

You have never stated that to me or on this blog... i asked you once and you only said, "Jesus taught truth" and then began arguing that He was not truth... this is well recorded on this blog.

I have not lied about what you have never stated...

that is a very illogical stand... and dishonest again on your part...

Again, if you do not agree with me i do not care... and as before on all your personal attacks on me... I forgive you again and again..

Again, i am done.

so be abundantly blessed.