Here are some thoughts I shared with Andrew aka TallSkinnyKiWi as he was pointing a blog by Steve Camp.
Wow, I was just listening to some Steve Camp and telling my wife how he used to stand against commercialization of Christian music... he believed as Keith Green did that it was free from God, and then to be given freely to all as it was not theirs to begin with and if someone could pay... great, if not it was a ministry.... I was contemplating uploading some of his songs that meant something to me “back in the day” to my online radio station... as I have considered that view very cool and a bit "postmodern" and as I was retelling it to my wife, I was wondering a bit about him and what he has been doing….
So this is very disappointing... and another case of “missing the point”.
I wanted to point out that many of the links of teachers are held high in “emerging” circles… (the teaching one, not Rush Limpbo), and also that he is just quoting small out of context quotes… as they are being ripped out of the bigger conversation and place in a “I’m right, your wrong” format. I just don’t care to go there. They are looking for just some point to say ALL is wrong… but miss that there are major issues in their own systematic religiosity. They miss that man’s reasoning is not the pinnacle of our faith… but Jesus is!
His assumption we ALL think alike and ALL hold to the same view and doctrines… even that we ALL “have trouble with absolutes” … missed the fine point that we are not against it, just not sure that the modern assertion is biblical … which is strange to say since we ALL hold the bible so low in our beliefs and values… (Tongue was in cheek as I said that).
I see that they miss that Jesus Himself said that we cannot understand the bible without be indwelled by the holy Spirit, so to assert that one can reason and just read the bible and get saved... without Jesus revealing… is way off track. (I have had two people argue over this on my blog as they attempted to prove that it is propositional truth that we must old told to be saved and I kept pointing out that it is Jesus who saves us John 5:39-40).
Right now I have some guy in the same town who is writing why he is “anti-missional” and I pointed out that Jesus told us to go on the Great Commission… and that was to spread the Kingdom of God… which includes but is not just about getting out of hell… He really has just created a straw man to knock down as he is like Steve camp, missing the point.
As far as deconstructing... that may be the "scholarly" definition, yet, I do not see that as the practical working out of emerging deconstructionism. I see rather the freedom to question and test and see if it is a “man made tradition” or “sound doctrine” and that we have in fact started to transcend the immature arguments that cause divisiveness and focus on the essentials and core of the teachings of Christ (all found in the bible). I have never been in a group of people who can engage in a conversation, with respect and totally disagree and still see the person is more important than “being right”. That does not diminish “right from wrong” but I see it raises it to be more valuable in that it allows the Holy Spirit room to grow people over traditions and man made doctrines.
Forgive me for rambling a bit there Andrew.
Blessings,iggy
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Sunday, July 23, 2006
Friday, July 21, 2006
Wednesday, July 19, 2006
Like I didn't already know... but look at #2!!!!!
Like I already didn't know this... But I am surprised by # 2. I bet you are also! This could be why some of you don't get me... LOL! Blessings, iggy | You scored as Emergent/Postmodern. You are Emergent/Postmodern in your theology. You feel alienated from older forms of church, you don't think they connect to modern culture very well. No one knows the whole truth about God, and we have much to learn from each other, and so learning takes place in dialogue. Evangelism should take place in relationships rather than through crusades and altar-calls. People are interested in spirituality and want to ask questions, so the church should help them to do this.
What's your theological worldview? created with QuizFarm.com |
Tuesday, July 18, 2006
Just a little bit of Montana for ya!
These are all on by West Yellowstone... Outside of Yellowstone Park. It is the Gallatin river and TES (my wife) took the pics.
Blessings,
iggy
emerging thought in Montana
emerging thought in Montana
I just thought I would let you know, YES you are at the wordofmouthministries blog…And yes I am experimenting with the new name. I may go back… I just wanted something that seemed to fit better… I wanted to get to the point this is a Blog about “emerging thought” (as I refer to the Postmodern/Emergent/emergent/-movement/non movement).
The address will remain the same as it is too hard to change… or impossible on Blogger.
Let me know what you think.
Blessings,
iggy
I just thought I would let you know, YES you are at the wordofmouthministries blog…And yes I am experimenting with the new name. I may go back… I just wanted something that seemed to fit better… I wanted to get to the point this is a Blog about “emerging thought” (as I refer to the Postmodern/Emergent/emergent/-movement/non movement).
The address will remain the same as it is too hard to change… or impossible on Blogger.
Let me know what you think.
Blessings,
iggy
Saturday, July 15, 2006
Jesus replied, "And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition?"
Jesus replied, "And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition?
Traditions are interesting things. Some are very good… some are fun… and some… just don’t make sense.
There is a story about a young woman who was cooking for friends. She was having roast beef and before she put it in the roasting pan, proceeded to cut the ends of the roast off. Here husband watched and asked why she did this. She replied, “Because my mother did this.”
Of course the husband seeing it a waste of good beef, asked, “Why did your mother do this?” and the young wife said, “I don’t know, but I bet she had a really good reason, like it helps with flavor or it cooks better somehow.”
Later she called her mother, and she finally got around to asking the big question.
“Mom, why do you cut the ends off the roasts before you cook them?”
Her mom laughed a bit and said, “Because my pan is too small.”
I see this as applicable in a couple of ways. First off much of what we are taught is caught. We watch and learn and literally catch things and learn how to do this. I have seen this in my daughter as she watches her big brother and has decided that walking is way cool! She is now trying to figure out how this upright walking thing works by watching her brother. LOL!
Also, sometimes things get passed down because that is how it was always done. It may be right… or even wrong… or just funny as in the story. Often when it is wrong it can lead to sad results and cause some very bad teachings being set out as truth… and after generation after generation, it gets set in the psyche if those who accept it as truth.
Traditions of man in relationship to our Christian faith has been victim of this for centuries and even now… more than ever I see many confused on some of the very basics of our faith.
One area is about “obeying God’s commands”. On one level there is no issue as that is what the scripture teaches. But, the issue is this:
I am not sure if I will be able to get to all these point in this one post. I do tend to get to the heart of the issue very quickly on this topic though.
Obedience is a funny word in scripture, and without a basic understanding of Grace and the finished works of Christ one will be hard pressed to understand it. I will not go into all of this as I have in many other posts gone into Grace and the finished works of Christ. Mostly I have gone into this in my posts on the exchanged life, which is basically this:
I received forgiveness at the Cross... But still was dead, I received the Life of Christ as a result of His Resurrection, and now live a life that is not my own. Jesus not only took away my sins… but gave me His eternal Life. It's now as I say, Jesus gave His Life for me, to give His Life to me, so He can Live His Life through me.
But what of this elusive obedience? The best scripture to explain this is in Romans 5:
11. Not only is this so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.
12. Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned-- 13. for before the law was given, sin was in the world. But sin is not taken into account when there is no law.
14. Nevertheless, death reigned from the time of Adam to the time of Moses, even over those who did not sin by breaking a command, as did Adam, who was a pattern of the one to come. 15. But the gift is not like the trespass. For if the many died by the trespass of the one man, how much more did God's grace and the gift that came by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, overflow to the many!
16. Again, the gift of God is not like the result of the one man's sin: The judgment followed one sin and brought condemnation, but the gift followed many trespasses and brought justification.
17. For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God's abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ.
18. Consequently, just as the result of one trespass was condemnation for all men, so also the result of one act of righteousness was justification that brings life for all men.
19. For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners, so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous.
20. The law was added so that the trespass might increase. But where sin increased, grace increased all the more, 21. so that, just as sin reigned in death, so also grace might reign through righteousness to bring eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
With this passage, “sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned.”
Adam and Eve fell in sin in the Garden. So with that sin entered the world. The world is now held hostage and is waiting for release. With this sin, death came, and because every man sins… every man dies. Pretty simple so far?
Sin was in the world before God gave the Law… so people in that time where not held to the Law… as in the Ten Commandments which came later and for an entirely different purpose than many teach today. It was because of Adam a man, that all men are judged for he was the pattern or model of the “one to come”… meaning Jesus.
Then God added the Law to add to our transgressions Galatians (3:19) and that is and was it’s purpose. It is in a way to add insult to injury! Not in a bad way, but in a way to drive us to God for mercy and grace.
Now the Good News! Romans 5: 8… God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us. 9. Since we have now been justified by his blood, how much more shall we be saved from God's wrath through him!
10. For if, when we were God's enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life!
11. Not only is this so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.
God showed His Grace and Mercy to us by giving us His Son to die in our place… even more than that to take on the wrath on Himself in our place.
Many think they need to get cleaned up to come to God… yet, the truth is you can’t get clean enough… and beyond that, while you where still and enemies of God, God reconciled you by Jesus’ death on the Cross… but many just stop there… and this adds to their confusion as they equate forgiveness with salvation. There are two extremes in this.
Now if anyone has read any of Brian McLaren’s books you will see that he often gets caught in this conundrum. As he says, “each has their advantages and their disadvantages.” The issue I see is that by just stopping at the cross and equating forgiveness with salvation, one can only have these choices. That is why I preach the exchanged life and spend so much time on speaking of the Resurrection of Jesus and that being we have received His Life unto salvation! Romans 5: 10 pretty much wraps this up… “For if, when we were God's enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life!”
Being reconciled through the cross means that the door to heaven is open… but one still will die if one does not take care to the death issue… Romans 6: 23. For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
It is not sins we need saved from, but our death… for God forgave our sins… really God took care of sins with the sacrificial system… but with Jesus it is now “once for all.” (Hebrews 7:27)
Notice again that the gift of God is not just forgiveness but also eternal life in Christ Jesus! Now once the sin and death issue is taken care of… we can move on to obedience…
But this post is long enough, so next time.
Blessings,
iggy
Traditions are interesting things. Some are very good… some are fun… and some… just don’t make sense.
There is a story about a young woman who was cooking for friends. She was having roast beef and before she put it in the roasting pan, proceeded to cut the ends of the roast off. Here husband watched and asked why she did this. She replied, “Because my mother did this.”
Of course the husband seeing it a waste of good beef, asked, “Why did your mother do this?” and the young wife said, “I don’t know, but I bet she had a really good reason, like it helps with flavor or it cooks better somehow.”
Later she called her mother, and she finally got around to asking the big question.
“Mom, why do you cut the ends off the roasts before you cook them?”
Her mom laughed a bit and said, “Because my pan is too small.”
I see this as applicable in a couple of ways. First off much of what we are taught is caught. We watch and learn and literally catch things and learn how to do this. I have seen this in my daughter as she watches her big brother and has decided that walking is way cool! She is now trying to figure out how this upright walking thing works by watching her brother. LOL!
Also, sometimes things get passed down because that is how it was always done. It may be right… or even wrong… or just funny as in the story. Often when it is wrong it can lead to sad results and cause some very bad teachings being set out as truth… and after generation after generation, it gets set in the psyche if those who accept it as truth.
Traditions of man in relationship to our Christian faith has been victim of this for centuries and even now… more than ever I see many confused on some of the very basics of our faith.
One area is about “obeying God’s commands”. On one level there is no issue as that is what the scripture teaches. But, the issue is this:
- Often people have a misunderstanding of obedience
- Often people confuse where and how obedience works in the life of a believer
- Often people confuse being obedient with obeying the Ten Commandments, or doctrines or even traditions.
I am not sure if I will be able to get to all these point in this one post. I do tend to get to the heart of the issue very quickly on this topic though.
- Often people have a misunderstanding of obedience
Obedience is a funny word in scripture, and without a basic understanding of Grace and the finished works of Christ one will be hard pressed to understand it. I will not go into all of this as I have in many other posts gone into Grace and the finished works of Christ. Mostly I have gone into this in my posts on the exchanged life, which is basically this:
I received forgiveness at the Cross... But still was dead, I received the Life of Christ as a result of His Resurrection, and now live a life that is not my own. Jesus not only took away my sins… but gave me His eternal Life. It's now as I say, Jesus gave His Life for me, to give His Life to me, so He can Live His Life through me.
But what of this elusive obedience? The best scripture to explain this is in Romans 5:
11. Not only is this so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.
12. Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned-- 13. for before the law was given, sin was in the world. But sin is not taken into account when there is no law.
14. Nevertheless, death reigned from the time of Adam to the time of Moses, even over those who did not sin by breaking a command, as did Adam, who was a pattern of the one to come. 15. But the gift is not like the trespass. For if the many died by the trespass of the one man, how much more did God's grace and the gift that came by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, overflow to the many!
16. Again, the gift of God is not like the result of the one man's sin: The judgment followed one sin and brought condemnation, but the gift followed many trespasses and brought justification.
17. For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God's abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ.
18. Consequently, just as the result of one trespass was condemnation for all men, so also the result of one act of righteousness was justification that brings life for all men.
19. For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners, so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous.
20. The law was added so that the trespass might increase. But where sin increased, grace increased all the more, 21. so that, just as sin reigned in death, so also grace might reign through righteousness to bring eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
With this passage, “sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned.”
Adam and Eve fell in sin in the Garden. So with that sin entered the world. The world is now held hostage and is waiting for release. With this sin, death came, and because every man sins… every man dies. Pretty simple so far?
Sin was in the world before God gave the Law… so people in that time where not held to the Law… as in the Ten Commandments which came later and for an entirely different purpose than many teach today. It was because of Adam a man, that all men are judged for he was the pattern or model of the “one to come”… meaning Jesus.
Then God added the Law to add to our transgressions Galatians (3:19) and that is and was it’s purpose. It is in a way to add insult to injury! Not in a bad way, but in a way to drive us to God for mercy and grace.
Now the Good News! Romans 5: 8… God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us. 9. Since we have now been justified by his blood, how much more shall we be saved from God's wrath through him!
10. For if, when we were God's enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life!
11. Not only is this so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.
God showed His Grace and Mercy to us by giving us His Son to die in our place… even more than that to take on the wrath on Himself in our place.
Many think they need to get cleaned up to come to God… yet, the truth is you can’t get clean enough… and beyond that, while you where still and enemies of God, God reconciled you by Jesus’ death on the Cross… but many just stop there… and this adds to their confusion as they equate forgiveness with salvation. There are two extremes in this.
- Universalism
- Exclusivism
Now if anyone has read any of Brian McLaren’s books you will see that he often gets caught in this conundrum. As he says, “each has their advantages and their disadvantages.” The issue I see is that by just stopping at the cross and equating forgiveness with salvation, one can only have these choices. That is why I preach the exchanged life and spend so much time on speaking of the Resurrection of Jesus and that being we have received His Life unto salvation! Romans 5: 10 pretty much wraps this up… “For if, when we were God's enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life!”
Being reconciled through the cross means that the door to heaven is open… but one still will die if one does not take care to the death issue… Romans 6: 23. For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
It is not sins we need saved from, but our death… for God forgave our sins… really God took care of sins with the sacrificial system… but with Jesus it is now “once for all.” (Hebrews 7:27)
Notice again that the gift of God is not just forgiveness but also eternal life in Christ Jesus! Now once the sin and death issue is taken care of… we can move on to obedience…
But this post is long enough, so next time.
Blessings,
iggy
What I have learned from my critics
What I have learned from my critics.
Disclaimer and qualifier: First off if you disagree with me, that is fine and to disagree and talk and discuss in a way that is respectful and thoughtful is a great and wonderful thing. In this we can grow with each other. This post is in no way about you. So please take this in the context of those who attack and judge… not seek to gain understanding. In this I see that it is out of love that many of you have approached me… and even ending our disagreements with kind words. It is not a sin to disagree, especially on minor things. Personally I have learned to hold tightly to the essentials, and loosely to the non essentials. In that I mean give grace in areas that though may be important, do not keep one from gaining salvation that comes from Jesus alone.
So what have I learned from my critics?
Truth; Romans 13: 9. The commandments, "Do not commit adultery," "Do not murder," "Do not steal," "Do not covet,” and whatever other commandment there may be, are summed up in this one rule: "Love your neighbor as yourself."
10. Love does no harm to its neighbor. Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.
11. And do this, understanding the present time. The hour has come for you to wake up from your slumber, because our salvation is nearer now than when we first believed.
What I have learned: I learned that it is a good thing to harm your neighbor… especially if it concerns one that they have to be right in their view at the detriment of another. I have learned from you that Love your neighbor does not apply if it interferes with your doctrines. I see that it is better to fulfill the Law, than to Love.
Truth: 1 Corinthians 13
1. If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal.
2. If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing.
3. If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing.
4. Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud.
5. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs.
6. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth.
7. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.
8. Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away.
9. For we know in part and we prophesy in part,
10. but when perfection comes, the imperfect disappears.
11. When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put childish ways behind me.
12. Now we see but a poor reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.
13. And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.
I have learned: If one is right and the other is wrong I can go off the handle at any moment and show no to little self control in my actions. I can call names and make fun or ruin someone’s reputation as long as I am right on my view of doctrine. If I see someone who seems to have strong views and may even envy them, it is better to mock them and tear them down because they could lead others astray and to trust God with judgment would be unheard of.
I have learned that politeness is not a ‘christian’ virtue, nor kindness, for anger as long as it is ‘righteous anger’ can justify most any action… and self justification is one of the main unwritten doctrines I have found you follow. I learned it is best to keep a long list of wrongs so I can pull them out and read them to mock or use them even if I have to twist someone’s words to make them look bad. I have learned to use evil to protect the truth.
I have learned to not trust that God is working outside of my own actions… so to trust in God is of no value… I must either judge and condemn now, as I am ‘truthing in love’ and save this person from their error. And to even consider what they may know would be an act of humility, which has no place in your unwritten doctrinal statement.
I have learned that love will not persevere if it interferes with your personal doctrine and to give up hope on someone if having any is of no value. I have learned that if love fails… hate prevails. For hate is a ‘christian’ value and a virtue.
Truth: 1 John 3: 13. Do not be surprised, my brothers, if the world hates you.
14. We know that we have passed from death to life, because we love our brothers. Anyone who does not love remains in death.
15. Anyone who hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life in him.
16. This is how we know what love is: Jesus Christ laid down his life for us. And we ought to lay down our lives for our brothers.
17. If anyone has material possessions and sees his brother in need but has no pity on him, how can the love of God be in him?
18. Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue but with actions and in truth.
1 John 4: 19. We love because he first loved us.
20. If anyone says, "I love God," yet hates his brother, he is a liar. For anyone who does not love his brother, whom he has seen, cannot love God, whom he has not seen.
21. And he has given us this command: Whoever loves God must also love his brother.
I have learned: I have learned that it is not only good but right to hate your brother if he thinks or speaks in any way contrary to my own personal view of doctrine. It is better to sacrifice the brother to be right that to give into self sacrifice. It is better to take away from someone else be it material or spiritual possessions and have no pity on him. It is better to speak the words of love like a seducer, than to love in action… It is better to hate one’s brother in the name of my doctrine, than to love him if I disagree.
I want to thank you for setting me on the path or self righteousness. I now see that Gandhi was very wrong when he said;
“I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.”---Mahatma Gandhi
I wonder where Gandhi ever picked up on this view? Maybe because he was not a Christian as I have begun to learn to be, from my critics.
Blessings?
iggy
Disclaimer and qualifier: First off if you disagree with me, that is fine and to disagree and talk and discuss in a way that is respectful and thoughtful is a great and wonderful thing. In this we can grow with each other. This post is in no way about you. So please take this in the context of those who attack and judge… not seek to gain understanding. In this I see that it is out of love that many of you have approached me… and even ending our disagreements with kind words. It is not a sin to disagree, especially on minor things. Personally I have learned to hold tightly to the essentials, and loosely to the non essentials. In that I mean give grace in areas that though may be important, do not keep one from gaining salvation that comes from Jesus alone.
So what have I learned from my critics?
Truth; Romans 13: 9. The commandments, "Do not commit adultery," "Do not murder," "Do not steal," "Do not covet,” and whatever other commandment there may be, are summed up in this one rule: "Love your neighbor as yourself."
10. Love does no harm to its neighbor. Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.
11. And do this, understanding the present time. The hour has come for you to wake up from your slumber, because our salvation is nearer now than when we first believed.
What I have learned: I learned that it is a good thing to harm your neighbor… especially if it concerns one that they have to be right in their view at the detriment of another. I have learned from you that Love your neighbor does not apply if it interferes with your doctrines. I see that it is better to fulfill the Law, than to Love.
Truth: 1 Corinthians 13
1. If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal.
2. If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing.
3. If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing.
4. Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud.
5. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs.
6. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth.
7. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.
8. Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away.
9. For we know in part and we prophesy in part,
10. but when perfection comes, the imperfect disappears.
11. When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put childish ways behind me.
12. Now we see but a poor reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.
13. And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.
I have learned: If one is right and the other is wrong I can go off the handle at any moment and show no to little self control in my actions. I can call names and make fun or ruin someone’s reputation as long as I am right on my view of doctrine. If I see someone who seems to have strong views and may even envy them, it is better to mock them and tear them down because they could lead others astray and to trust God with judgment would be unheard of.
I have learned that politeness is not a ‘christian’ virtue, nor kindness, for anger as long as it is ‘righteous anger’ can justify most any action… and self justification is one of the main unwritten doctrines I have found you follow. I learned it is best to keep a long list of wrongs so I can pull them out and read them to mock or use them even if I have to twist someone’s words to make them look bad. I have learned to use evil to protect the truth.
I have learned to not trust that God is working outside of my own actions… so to trust in God is of no value… I must either judge and condemn now, as I am ‘truthing in love’ and save this person from their error. And to even consider what they may know would be an act of humility, which has no place in your unwritten doctrinal statement.
I have learned that love will not persevere if it interferes with your personal doctrine and to give up hope on someone if having any is of no value. I have learned that if love fails… hate prevails. For hate is a ‘christian’ value and a virtue.
Truth: 1 John 3: 13. Do not be surprised, my brothers, if the world hates you.
14. We know that we have passed from death to life, because we love our brothers. Anyone who does not love remains in death.
15. Anyone who hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life in him.
16. This is how we know what love is: Jesus Christ laid down his life for us. And we ought to lay down our lives for our brothers.
17. If anyone has material possessions and sees his brother in need but has no pity on him, how can the love of God be in him?
18. Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue but with actions and in truth.
1 John 4: 19. We love because he first loved us.
20. If anyone says, "I love God," yet hates his brother, he is a liar. For anyone who does not love his brother, whom he has seen, cannot love God, whom he has not seen.
21. And he has given us this command: Whoever loves God must also love his brother.
I have learned: I have learned that it is not only good but right to hate your brother if he thinks or speaks in any way contrary to my own personal view of doctrine. It is better to sacrifice the brother to be right that to give into self sacrifice. It is better to take away from someone else be it material or spiritual possessions and have no pity on him. It is better to speak the words of love like a seducer, than to love in action… It is better to hate one’s brother in the name of my doctrine, than to love him if I disagree.
I want to thank you for setting me on the path or self righteousness. I now see that Gandhi was very wrong when he said;
“I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.”---Mahatma Gandhi
I wonder where Gandhi ever picked up on this view? Maybe because he was not a Christian as I have begun to learn to be, from my critics.
Blessings?
iggy
Friday, July 14, 2006
Who are the pigs?
Who are the pigs?
I read this, this morning and had the thought..
Who are the pigs? The interesting thing is that it is in the beatitudes. Yet right after healing many in chapter 4. causing a large crowd to follow Him, then ending with Healing a leper in chapter 8 of Matt.
It seems to me that in the Sermon on the Mount Jesus addresses the contrast of those in power. The authority and challenges them with the coming of the Kingdom. Jesus is saying in affect that things in the Kingdom are upside down from this world’s power structure.
So, after he says “check the log in your own eye.”
He goes on to say;
“Matt7:6 “Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to
pigs. If you do, they may trample them under their feet, and then turn
and tear you to pieces.”
In that I have always assumed it to be, people in general who do not care to hear the Good News, yet here I see with the “political” attachment that Jesus is talking of the religious leaders. The same He called “vipers” and “white washed tombs”.
The reason I say that is because the Jews were looking for a political leader to run Rome out of town and instead this prophet, Jesus, shows up and seems to be against the religious leaders. To the point of going out of His way to touch those who were deemed unclean, such as the lepers. I see this is still actively true today… Be that anyone who desires to control others or God Himself by the power of Religion. In this they attempt to hold God hostage and His people hostage as they hold God to their doctrine… as opposed to having a relationship with the Father through Jesus. In essence they desire to be higher than God.
So, I am saying that my view has shifted in the last few years to seeing Jesus had and still has a specific agenda, of the, “on earth as it is in Heaven.” of tossing the Power and Authority structure on it’s head, and replacing it with a Relational system, based on our relationship with Jesus and being part of His Kingdom.
I guess I have tossed out enough fodder for thought... What think ye?
Blessings,
iggy
I read this, this morning and had the thought..
Who are the pigs? The interesting thing is that it is in the beatitudes. Yet right after healing many in chapter 4. causing a large crowd to follow Him, then ending with Healing a leper in chapter 8 of Matt.
It seems to me that in the Sermon on the Mount Jesus addresses the contrast of those in power. The authority and challenges them with the coming of the Kingdom. Jesus is saying in affect that things in the Kingdom are upside down from this world’s power structure.
So, after he says “check the log in your own eye.”
He goes on to say;
“Matt7:6 “Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to
pigs. If you do, they may trample them under their feet, and then turn
and tear you to pieces.”
In that I have always assumed it to be, people in general who do not care to hear the Good News, yet here I see with the “political” attachment that Jesus is talking of the religious leaders. The same He called “vipers” and “white washed tombs”.
The reason I say that is because the Jews were looking for a political leader to run Rome out of town and instead this prophet, Jesus, shows up and seems to be against the religious leaders. To the point of going out of His way to touch those who were deemed unclean, such as the lepers. I see this is still actively true today… Be that anyone who desires to control others or God Himself by the power of Religion. In this they attempt to hold God hostage and His people hostage as they hold God to their doctrine… as opposed to having a relationship with the Father through Jesus. In essence they desire to be higher than God.
So, I am saying that my view has shifted in the last few years to seeing Jesus had and still has a specific agenda, of the, “on earth as it is in Heaven.” of tossing the Power and Authority structure on it’s head, and replacing it with a Relational system, based on our relationship with Jesus and being part of His Kingdom.
I guess I have tossed out enough fodder for thought... What think ye?
Blessings,
iggy
Why we should know our History
Why we should know our history…
First off thanks to Stephen Shields blog for pointing this out.
I find it a bit funny that “scholars” have just decided that the Gospel of Judas was not written by Judas… uhhh no duh,
1. He killed himself!
And
B. Irenaeus wrote about this so called Gospel of Judas a long, long, long, long time ago.
“Chapter XXXI.-Doctrines of the Cainites.
1. Others again declare that Cain derived his being from the Power above, and acknowledge that Esau, Korah, the Sodomites, and all such persons, are related to themselves. On this account, they add, they have been assailed by the Creator, yet no one of them has suffered injury. For Sophia was in the habit of carrying off that which belonged to her from them to herself. They declare that Judas the traitor was thoroughly acquainted with these things, and that he alone, knowing the truth as no others did, accomplished the mystery of the betrayal; by him all things, both earthly and heavenly, were thus thrown into confusion. They produce a fictitious history of this kind, which they style the Gospel of Judas.”
To me this was a non-issue… it was not a new gospel, but a heresy that had been found… and once again, it was found wanting…
Blessings,
iggy
First off thanks to Stephen Shields blog for pointing this out.
I find it a bit funny that “scholars” have just decided that the Gospel of Judas was not written by Judas… uhhh no duh,
1. He killed himself!
And
B. Irenaeus wrote about this so called Gospel of Judas a long, long, long, long time ago.
“Chapter XXXI.-Doctrines of the Cainites.
1. Others again declare that Cain derived his being from the Power above, and acknowledge that Esau, Korah, the Sodomites, and all such persons, are related to themselves. On this account, they add, they have been assailed by the Creator, yet no one of them has suffered injury. For Sophia was in the habit of carrying off that which belonged to her from them to herself. They declare that Judas the traitor was thoroughly acquainted with these things, and that he alone, knowing the truth as no others did, accomplished the mystery of the betrayal; by him all things, both earthly and heavenly, were thus thrown into confusion. They produce a fictitious history of this kind, which they style the Gospel of Judas.”
To me this was a non-issue… it was not a new gospel, but a heresy that had been found… and once again, it was found wanting…
Blessings,
iggy
Lifting up out of the mire
Lifting up out of the mire.
I have been putting a lot of thought in this idea of moderating my blog… It just kills me a bit to admit that I have in some ways been casting pearls before swine. In this day and age one must realize that we often have no idea who we are talking to online. They could be anyone, or someone who hides behind anonymity of the web. I have chosen for whatever reason to lay it all out there… warts and all. With that though I have found that I must protect not only myself, but also the precious gift of teaching that God has entrusted me with.
I have decided that moderating is a good thing as it will allow me to streamline those who want legitimate conversation versus those who have only the desire to drag me into the quagmire of argumentative debates and name calling. I am not saying I am not letting someone who disagrees with me through, or thinks I am wrong even. It will be more in the fashion of how they approach this blog with their comments. I have no desire to attack the person. I will still fight against what I see as error and distortion of the purity of the truth that is in scripture.
In a conversation, one does not attack the character or person themselves, they may challenge the statements or ask for clarity, yet to attack someone without even knowing them is really foolish… I will not be part of that on a personal level.
If I do sound the alarm on a false teaching… and it hits you in some way… I implore you to check your own heart before you come after me. Again, if you come with hate at me I will just add you to my prayer list and you will to have no voice here.
It is my hope as it was from the beginning that one might gain from my journey and that God can use even a fool like me to show His glory. I never assume I am never wrong. I am amazed when I am even remotely right! I will be depending more on Christ for grace in my writings and in my approach for seekers of Truth…
Blessings,
iggy
I have been putting a lot of thought in this idea of moderating my blog… It just kills me a bit to admit that I have in some ways been casting pearls before swine. In this day and age one must realize that we often have no idea who we are talking to online. They could be anyone, or someone who hides behind anonymity of the web. I have chosen for whatever reason to lay it all out there… warts and all. With that though I have found that I must protect not only myself, but also the precious gift of teaching that God has entrusted me with.
I have decided that moderating is a good thing as it will allow me to streamline those who want legitimate conversation versus those who have only the desire to drag me into the quagmire of argumentative debates and name calling. I am not saying I am not letting someone who disagrees with me through, or thinks I am wrong even. It will be more in the fashion of how they approach this blog with their comments. I have no desire to attack the person. I will still fight against what I see as error and distortion of the purity of the truth that is in scripture.
In a conversation, one does not attack the character or person themselves, they may challenge the statements or ask for clarity, yet to attack someone without even knowing them is really foolish… I will not be part of that on a personal level.
If I do sound the alarm on a false teaching… and it hits you in some way… I implore you to check your own heart before you come after me. Again, if you come with hate at me I will just add you to my prayer list and you will to have no voice here.
It is my hope as it was from the beginning that one might gain from my journey and that God can use even a fool like me to show His glory. I never assume I am never wrong. I am amazed when I am even remotely right! I will be depending more on Christ for grace in my writings and in my approach for seekers of Truth…
Blessings,
iggy
Saturday, July 08, 2006
Is It Wrong To Be Right?
Is It Wrong To Be Right?
Before I answer this question I know many of you will already have judged what I am about to say. At least you might be partially right, yet will still be wrong. Yet, if your intention is to read this post and then set out to “get me” in some heretical view, or prove I am ‘wrong’, please don’t waste your time on this post. I am seeking genuine seekers who desire to go deeper into Christ… and not whiners or heretic hunters or accusers of the brethren to gather more fodder for their evil stew of judgmentalism and condemnation.
So, if your intention and motive is to judge me or anyone else STOP READING NOW! YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED! Because this will cause the honest man to think and look at their own heart and judge themselves… looking at the plank in their own eye instead of focusing on the sliver in my eye or someone else’s.
So, if you keep reading, you will have to be honest with yourself…
So is it wrong to be right… sometimes!
How can that be? Be patient as I try to unwind this in a way that gives it some clarity.
First, many think that PM/E/e ers do not believe in right and wrong or absolutes… it is true some may not, yet also true that many more do. In fact, there is often a misunderstanding of what we mean when we say we do not think in right/wrong, but think on doing what is good.
In doing good one will always default to doing what is truly right.
The best illustration comes from scripture with the story of the Good Samaritan…
In that, a man is beaten by a thief and left for dead on the side of the road, a priest and a rabbi, or the righteous of the story, see him yet think that to touch the man would make them unclean… so they pass him by. I often wonder as to why they did not at least send help after the man… maybe because the Jews of the day say the Samaritan as less than human, as they were half breed of gentile and Jew. Instead we have the most unlikely hero in Jewish literature… the Good Samaritan come to the rescue. To say ‘good’ before Samaritan is like saying a ‘good’ Nazi… at least to the mind of the Jew in that day… there was nothing good about a Samaritan. A Samaritan was not allowed in the temple in Jerusalem… and were considered equal with dogs.
Good Sam not only stopped and helped the guy, He set him up in a local motel and prepaid for the room until the man could recover… and assured that when he came back that he would pay any additional cost that could incur.
In other words, Sam did what was good.
I like to look at it this way… after we come to Christ; He has forgiven the wrong in our life and made it/us right in His Righteousness… so we are free to do what is good.
Now, take this story and think of the Jews in Nazi Germany. You have hidden them in your cellar and there is a knock at the door. You answer it to find it is the SS squad hunting down Jews… they ask you if you have seen any or know where any are at… being a Christian, under right and wrong thinking, you say, “ I have them in my cellar as I can’t lie, for I am a Christian.” The Jews are then taken and killed.
What is wrong with that picture? It is that there was a higher good and one was focused not on it, but on being right…
Let’s break this down in Christianese to help some of you understand what I am saying…
To say I am right… is to say in Christianese, “I am righteous.” In that to say another is wrong is to say, “You are unrighteous.”
Do you catch that?
Suddenly we are focused on our righteousness over another’s… forgetting none of us are righteous except for Jesus… for none of us are perfect as our Father in heaven is perfect. That is the standard Jesus set… not me. To say that you are righteous, is to say you are without sin… and as John says in 1 john 1… “If you say you are without sin, the truth is not in you.” So, if you can be perfect in all of your own righteousness, and not fail or hold one wrong view, then, yes, your doctrine will save you! Go ahead try… I dare you!
Now, if the Nazi’s knocked at the door I would hope you would have responded as Rahab did as she hid the Hebrew spies. She lied to those who were against the True God… in order to do the higher good and save the men of the True God. In that she was approved righteous to God.
I am not saying as some will try to say I am that we are free to lie willy nilly and do as we please, but rather to use wisdom and discernment… given to us by the Holy Spirit to look into a situation beyond just right and wrong.
Solomon had two women standing before him… both claimed to be a baby’s mother… Solomon ordered the baby to be cut in half… NOT ONLY NOT GOOD, BUT VERY WRONG TO MURDER!!!!! Only then one of the so called mothers called out in mercy that the baby be spared and that the other woman could have the baby… she was the real mother! Solomon in his wisdom knew the real mother would love beyond just letting the baby die. That is wisdom and discernment… versus being a judge of another.
Again, I do believe in right and wrong, yet I do not depend on my own righteousness, but rather Christ’s Righteousness in my value structure. When I debate it is not to prove I am right and the other is wrong, yet rather to show that I could also be wrong… and find out later you could be right… or we are both right to a degree, or both plainly wrong altogether… and that is where humility comes into play. All parties must remember no one is right… only Christ Himself… and that if we are right it is only because He imputed His righteousness to us and that there is none of our own… so that we do not boast about being….. Right in ourselves… or rather self righteous. That is why I think of my blog or discussion group like sitting at a coffee shop with friends having coffee and a pleasant conversation, rather than one of those sickening political debates that only show both are as idiotic as can be… shaming both parties.
Modernistic thought does not grasp this… it seeks only to be right in its view at the expense that another is wrong. Just a slight glance over the Christian faith and history, on e can see this as many stand outside abortion clinics and calling names out to the woman such as “baby killers” and extreme examples of shooting the Dr. and blowing up the clinics (real good). Most recently, the example would be how some pastors condone hatred and protest gay rights with signs that say. “God hates fags.”
True God does hate sin, any and all… so one with their logic would have to say, “God hate gossips”, “God hates gluttons”, “God hates liars”, and so on. This list would include any of your own personal pet sins… “God hates pornography lookers” … yet, I read in John 3: 16; “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
17. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him.
18. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.
How can a God so loving, be so hateful?
Again, it is sin that God hates not the people… He died for them so they would not perish…. Yet we gleefully send many to hell without a worry… with that I wonder which is the greater sin?
If you try to say I am justifying homosexuality you have missed the point completely so don’t even go there… you will only come across as a fool.
So am I right or am I right? LOL! Really be careful and mindful the next time you are quick to judge another… is it out your own self righteousness or out of goodness that you are trying to reach that person… in doing good, you will be sharing the righteousness of Christ… and that will be more powerful than anything.
Blessings,
iggy
Before I answer this question I know many of you will already have judged what I am about to say. At least you might be partially right, yet will still be wrong. Yet, if your intention is to read this post and then set out to “get me” in some heretical view, or prove I am ‘wrong’, please don’t waste your time on this post. I am seeking genuine seekers who desire to go deeper into Christ… and not whiners or heretic hunters or accusers of the brethren to gather more fodder for their evil stew of judgmentalism and condemnation.
So, if your intention and motive is to judge me or anyone else STOP READING NOW! YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED! Because this will cause the honest man to think and look at their own heart and judge themselves… looking at the plank in their own eye instead of focusing on the sliver in my eye or someone else’s.
So, if you keep reading, you will have to be honest with yourself…
So is it wrong to be right… sometimes!
How can that be? Be patient as I try to unwind this in a way that gives it some clarity.
First, many think that PM/E/e ers do not believe in right and wrong or absolutes… it is true some may not, yet also true that many more do. In fact, there is often a misunderstanding of what we mean when we say we do not think in right/wrong, but think on doing what is good.
In doing good one will always default to doing what is truly right.
The best illustration comes from scripture with the story of the Good Samaritan…
In that, a man is beaten by a thief and left for dead on the side of the road, a priest and a rabbi, or the righteous of the story, see him yet think that to touch the man would make them unclean… so they pass him by. I often wonder as to why they did not at least send help after the man… maybe because the Jews of the day say the Samaritan as less than human, as they were half breed of gentile and Jew. Instead we have the most unlikely hero in Jewish literature… the Good Samaritan come to the rescue. To say ‘good’ before Samaritan is like saying a ‘good’ Nazi… at least to the mind of the Jew in that day… there was nothing good about a Samaritan. A Samaritan was not allowed in the temple in Jerusalem… and were considered equal with dogs.
Good Sam not only stopped and helped the guy, He set him up in a local motel and prepaid for the room until the man could recover… and assured that when he came back that he would pay any additional cost that could incur.
In other words, Sam did what was good.
I like to look at it this way… after we come to Christ; He has forgiven the wrong in our life and made it/us right in His Righteousness… so we are free to do what is good.
Now, take this story and think of the Jews in Nazi Germany. You have hidden them in your cellar and there is a knock at the door. You answer it to find it is the SS squad hunting down Jews… they ask you if you have seen any or know where any are at… being a Christian, under right and wrong thinking, you say, “ I have them in my cellar as I can’t lie, for I am a Christian.” The Jews are then taken and killed.
What is wrong with that picture? It is that there was a higher good and one was focused not on it, but on being right…
Let’s break this down in Christianese to help some of you understand what I am saying…
To say I am right… is to say in Christianese, “I am righteous.” In that to say another is wrong is to say, “You are unrighteous.”
Do you catch that?
Suddenly we are focused on our righteousness over another’s… forgetting none of us are righteous except for Jesus… for none of us are perfect as our Father in heaven is perfect. That is the standard Jesus set… not me. To say that you are righteous, is to say you are without sin… and as John says in 1 john 1… “If you say you are without sin, the truth is not in you.” So, if you can be perfect in all of your own righteousness, and not fail or hold one wrong view, then, yes, your doctrine will save you! Go ahead try… I dare you!
Now, if the Nazi’s knocked at the door I would hope you would have responded as Rahab did as she hid the Hebrew spies. She lied to those who were against the True God… in order to do the higher good and save the men of the True God. In that she was approved righteous to God.
I am not saying as some will try to say I am that we are free to lie willy nilly and do as we please, but rather to use wisdom and discernment… given to us by the Holy Spirit to look into a situation beyond just right and wrong.
Solomon had two women standing before him… both claimed to be a baby’s mother… Solomon ordered the baby to be cut in half… NOT ONLY NOT GOOD, BUT VERY WRONG TO MURDER!!!!! Only then one of the so called mothers called out in mercy that the baby be spared and that the other woman could have the baby… she was the real mother! Solomon in his wisdom knew the real mother would love beyond just letting the baby die. That is wisdom and discernment… versus being a judge of another.
Again, I do believe in right and wrong, yet I do not depend on my own righteousness, but rather Christ’s Righteousness in my value structure. When I debate it is not to prove I am right and the other is wrong, yet rather to show that I could also be wrong… and find out later you could be right… or we are both right to a degree, or both plainly wrong altogether… and that is where humility comes into play. All parties must remember no one is right… only Christ Himself… and that if we are right it is only because He imputed His righteousness to us and that there is none of our own… so that we do not boast about being….. Right in ourselves… or rather self righteous. That is why I think of my blog or discussion group like sitting at a coffee shop with friends having coffee and a pleasant conversation, rather than one of those sickening political debates that only show both are as idiotic as can be… shaming both parties.
Modernistic thought does not grasp this… it seeks only to be right in its view at the expense that another is wrong. Just a slight glance over the Christian faith and history, on e can see this as many stand outside abortion clinics and calling names out to the woman such as “baby killers” and extreme examples of shooting the Dr. and blowing up the clinics (real good). Most recently, the example would be how some pastors condone hatred and protest gay rights with signs that say. “God hates fags.”
True God does hate sin, any and all… so one with their logic would have to say, “God hate gossips”, “God hates gluttons”, “God hates liars”, and so on. This list would include any of your own personal pet sins… “God hates pornography lookers” … yet, I read in John 3: 16; “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
17. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him.
18. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.
How can a God so loving, be so hateful?
Again, it is sin that God hates not the people… He died for them so they would not perish…. Yet we gleefully send many to hell without a worry… with that I wonder which is the greater sin?
If you try to say I am justifying homosexuality you have missed the point completely so don’t even go there… you will only come across as a fool.
So am I right or am I right? LOL! Really be careful and mindful the next time you are quick to judge another… is it out your own self righteousness or out of goodness that you are trying to reach that person… in doing good, you will be sharing the righteousness of Christ… and that will be more powerful than anything.
Blessings,
iggy
More thoughts on the anti missional post...
More thoughts on the anti missional post.
Here is the link to read it yourself…
http://zitsemerge.blogspot.com/2006/07/why-i-am-not-missional-part-one.html
In this Phil takes one statement in which Brian says in his book a Generous Orthodoxy page 112. And twists it to mean something else...Then rationalizes that not being missional is right. I guess the alternative is to preach hell and select for ourselve who will get in? Now that sounds a little ungenerous and unorthodox let alone un-biblical and heretical.
“But what about heaven and hell? You ask, is everyone in?
My reply: Why do you consider me qualified to make this pronouncement? Isn’t this God’s business? Isn’t it clear that I do not believe this is the right question for a missional Christian to ask? Can’t we talk of a while about God’s will being done on earth as in heaven instead of jumping to how to escape the earth and get to heaven as quickly as possible? Can’t we talk a while about overthrowing and undermining every hell is stronghold in our lives and in our world?”
Can’t one see that the Great Commission is greater than just getting people out of hell… how ever one defines hell?
Here is some scripture to back this up… I will only give the reference as you can go and search this out yourselves as I think my readers can think for themselves… if they set to apply themselves.
8. Acts 5:42. Day after day, in the temple courts and from house to house, they never stopped teaching and proclaiming the good news that Jesus is the Christ. (Emphasis is mine of course)
This is not an exhaustive list by far, yet enough to see that God is more interested in us not perishing and growing in the Grace and Knowledge of Christ, than keeping us just from going to hell… in fact, getting out of going to hell is just a byproduct of our salvation…
Blessings,
iggy
Here is the link to read it yourself…
http://zitsemerge.blogspot.com/2006/07/why-i-am-not-missional-part-one.html
In this Phil takes one statement in which Brian says in his book a Generous Orthodoxy page 112. And twists it to mean something else...Then rationalizes that not being missional is right. I guess the alternative is to preach hell and select for ourselve who will get in? Now that sounds a little ungenerous and unorthodox let alone un-biblical and heretical.
“But what about heaven and hell? You ask, is everyone in?
My reply: Why do you consider me qualified to make this pronouncement? Isn’t this God’s business? Isn’t it clear that I do not believe this is the right question for a missional Christian to ask? Can’t we talk of a while about God’s will being done on earth as in heaven instead of jumping to how to escape the earth and get to heaven as quickly as possible? Can’t we talk a while about overthrowing and undermining every hell is stronghold in our lives and in our world?”
Can’t one see that the Great Commission is greater than just getting people out of hell… how ever one defines hell?
Here is some scripture to back this up… I will only give the reference as you can go and search this out yourselves as I think my readers can think for themselves… if they set to apply themselves.
- Romans 2 (the whole chapter)
- John 3:16 and surrounding passages
- 2 Peter 3: 9-10
- 2 Corinthians 10:3-5
- Acts 4:12
- Luke 1:69 corresponding with 2 Samuel 22:3
- Mark 16:15 Note it says preach the “Good News!” Not that you don’t go to hell… which is part of the good news… But the good news is
8. Acts 5:42. Day after day, in the temple courts and from house to house, they never stopped teaching and proclaiming the good news that Jesus is the Christ. (Emphasis is mine of course)
This is not an exhaustive list by far, yet enough to see that God is more interested in us not perishing and growing in the Grace and Knowledge of Christ, than keeping us just from going to hell… in fact, getting out of going to hell is just a byproduct of our salvation…
Blessings,
iggy
To those against the Great Commission or i mean being Missional
To those against the Great Commission or I mean being Missional
To you anti-missional people out there… we emerging thought people use that for term for the great commission… so to us, if you say you are anti-missional, you are against the great commission… which Jesus commanded us to go and do!!!!!
One should do more reading with understanding before they say negative things out of ignorance.
I really had to laugh at one persons attempt to twist and put words in Brian McLarens mouth then slam the great commission as being wrong! I guess hate blinds people…
Blessings,
iggy
To you anti-missional people out there… we emerging thought people use that for term for the great commission… so to us, if you say you are anti-missional, you are against the great commission… which Jesus commanded us to go and do!!!!!
One should do more reading with understanding before they say negative things out of ignorance.
I really had to laugh at one persons attempt to twist and put words in Brian McLarens mouth then slam the great commission as being wrong! I guess hate blinds people…
Blessings,
iggy
Tuesday, July 04, 2006
Sadder still...
Because of people like Ben this blog will for a time be moderated just like the accusers of the brethren blogs do like Sl!ce of LAyoddahseeya and Mr. Perkins blogs... I may if one is gracious let it through, yet I will not let hate be preached on this blog, for unlike people like Ben...
I do not believe hate is a Christian value.
Again, Ben... Be a man and make your own blog... In that say what you want... Spill the hate... I will even do a post to direct people to it! I just believe you can't back up your accusations. At least without twisting them is some way other than what was said.
You see, if you bothered to actually converse, you would have found that their are liberals, and conservatives and moderates in emerging thought (as I call it). Emergent is very conservative... To the point it is mostly Evangelical and some Calvinistic in their theology... Both of those you have slandered in your ignorance. In talking to them the only difference you would see is that they put their faith to action!
Yes, some may think what you have claimed yet, the majority do not... Surprise! If you would stop you tirade against and really took the time, you would have found we are people... Like you, well, except without the hate... And a little more well read. For instance, I am probably much more conservative than you!!!! I think Rush Limbah is a sell out to the Rep party... And that clouds his conservative view... That he has really lost touch with the people... That he has created his own upscale Rio Linda... I am personally an O'Reilly guy... No spin!
You have accused me of pushing Brian McLaren. I do have links and think he has many good things to say... If you bothered to ever read for youself you might actually see he does nt say much that is atributed to him. He even seems to hold a higher standard on human sexuality than you seem to think. He questions why it is alright that some churches let heterosexuals who are not married be active in churches yet we seem to "hate" homosexuals and seem to not care thta they to were loved by God and that being Christ died for them... Yet, people like you seem content in letting these people go to hell and seem happy about it as they go!
Yet, I do not agree with Brian on every point. I do however think he inspires thought and even sets out challenges, which to me set me to dig deeper into my faith... For you see I have a God big enough to handle challenges. I do however quote scripture and teach the exchanged life as much as I can. Yet, all you see is a little green button that says Emergent and get enraged.
Also, I have come in contact with people where using your style and approach only makes them run away from God... In fact many are recovering from abusive people like you! In that I have decided to reach out to the hurting, and lift them back on the path... To rise above abuse to be able to see Christ in spite of people who seem more interested in being right that they are blind to those they send to hell!
Really, all you have done is alienated people from you and those who think like you and from God... Not once in our dialog did you lift Christ up... Only yourself and your view of truth... Which is cold and lifeless. It is not Christ centered... but only set on a bunch of propositions you have strung together... and just like the pharasees, look in the scripture for life, and can't find it... because it is Christ Jesus you are looking for... and without Jesus indwelling you, you cannot understand what you read.
I have found that there is more intelligence and a deeper searching of Christ than what you have represented... You see I was where you are once... But Grace found me. I surrendered to Christ and have not looked back. I used to depend on MY KEEPING PERFECT DOCTRINE... And found I could not, but Jesus did... And I trust in the finished work of Christ.
So, now I add one more quote to your collection...
I have taken on littler men that you... And won.
By the way... I guess this must be close to home as you seemed to yelp very loudly, are you sure you are not a closet emergant?
Go in peace! Serve your god.
iggy
I do not believe hate is a Christian value.
Again, Ben... Be a man and make your own blog... In that say what you want... Spill the hate... I will even do a post to direct people to it! I just believe you can't back up your accusations. At least without twisting them is some way other than what was said.
You see, if you bothered to actually converse, you would have found that their are liberals, and conservatives and moderates in emerging thought (as I call it). Emergent is very conservative... To the point it is mostly Evangelical and some Calvinistic in their theology... Both of those you have slandered in your ignorance. In talking to them the only difference you would see is that they put their faith to action!
Yes, some may think what you have claimed yet, the majority do not... Surprise! If you would stop you tirade against and really took the time, you would have found we are people... Like you, well, except without the hate... And a little more well read. For instance, I am probably much more conservative than you!!!! I think Rush Limbah is a sell out to the Rep party... And that clouds his conservative view... That he has really lost touch with the people... That he has created his own upscale Rio Linda... I am personally an O'Reilly guy... No spin!
You have accused me of pushing Brian McLaren. I do have links and think he has many good things to say... If you bothered to ever read for youself you might actually see he does nt say much that is atributed to him. He even seems to hold a higher standard on human sexuality than you seem to think. He questions why it is alright that some churches let heterosexuals who are not married be active in churches yet we seem to "hate" homosexuals and seem to not care thta they to were loved by God and that being Christ died for them... Yet, people like you seem content in letting these people go to hell and seem happy about it as they go!
Yet, I do not agree with Brian on every point. I do however think he inspires thought and even sets out challenges, which to me set me to dig deeper into my faith... For you see I have a God big enough to handle challenges. I do however quote scripture and teach the exchanged life as much as I can. Yet, all you see is a little green button that says Emergent and get enraged.
Also, I have come in contact with people where using your style and approach only makes them run away from God... In fact many are recovering from abusive people like you! In that I have decided to reach out to the hurting, and lift them back on the path... To rise above abuse to be able to see Christ in spite of people who seem more interested in being right that they are blind to those they send to hell!
Really, all you have done is alienated people from you and those who think like you and from God... Not once in our dialog did you lift Christ up... Only yourself and your view of truth... Which is cold and lifeless. It is not Christ centered... but only set on a bunch of propositions you have strung together... and just like the pharasees, look in the scripture for life, and can't find it... because it is Christ Jesus you are looking for... and without Jesus indwelling you, you cannot understand what you read.
I have found that there is more intelligence and a deeper searching of Christ than what you have represented... You see I was where you are once... But Grace found me. I surrendered to Christ and have not looked back. I used to depend on MY KEEPING PERFECT DOCTRINE... And found I could not, but Jesus did... And I trust in the finished work of Christ.
So, now I add one more quote to your collection...
I have taken on littler men that you... And won.
By the way... I guess this must be close to home as you seemed to yelp very loudly, are you sure you are not a closet emergant?
Go in peace! Serve your god.
iggy
Monday, July 03, 2006
The Bible and Judging Others... Beware!
The Bible and Judging Others… Beware.
I have been battling a cold for about 2 weeks, which is funny as it seems every time I have someone start telling me I am a heretic or worse, (in love of course) I seem to come down with some sort of cold or flu right as it starts… it seems to set me into a very grumpy mood as I try to respond and not react to some of the nonsense that is thrown at me. The funny thing is many of these so called defenders of truth may actually be able to communicate with me and I might see something different if they approached me in a different way…
And that is also true in how we must approach those who are lost. How and why do we think anyone will listen to the “Good News” with all the added garbage… the doctrines that defend judgmentalism? Even Jesus did not come to judge, but to save us! (John 12:46-50)
Yet, some seem to be higher than Jesus and deem themselves worthy of being a judge over other men… which is anathema to the teachings of the bible… and of Christ Jesus! (Rom 14:4)
In there is a way that is biblical in how we judge the world and that is to walk in love… as we do this without fault and love God, then the world and the Satanic powers have no where to stand but in judgment as we deem God worthy of our love. So it is in Love we judge, not by some standard of righteousness we create. It is only as we stand in the righteousness of Christ, Who is worthy that we with Him please the Father.
In that when Christ returns then HE WILL JUDGE ALL by His righteousness and that being THE STANDARD. For some to stand on their own on that day is a sad thing indeed. Even worse is to stand in judgment now, as if you are Christ Himself… some sort of pseudo Christ, that deems his own righteousness as the standard… beware if you stand there as this is holding one’s own righteousness as equal with Jesus’…
This is true and if one does not see it they are blind…
Luke 6: 35. But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. 36. Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful. 37. "Do not judge and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven. NIV
Yet, some come to this blog as a so called brother and attack and condemn me in a way that even Christ Himself never did to a sinner, let alone one He called his own. In doing this you condemn yourself… not me… or anyone else.
You see you are usurping the authority of Christ as you stand as an accuser of the brethren, and with that you are standing not with Christ but with Satan for that is his nature and what he has done from the beginning… and that is his title… the accuser of the brethren. If you question this, then read in Rev 12: 9. The great dragon was hurled down--that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.
10. Then I heard a loud voice in heaven say: "Now have come the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God, and the authority of his Christ. For the accuser of our brothers, who accuses them before our God day and night, has been hurled down.
11. They overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony; they did not love their lives so much as to shrink from death. NIV
So, do you still want to stand in judgment? Then go ahead, and that is your fate. Do you still want to justify yourself by thinking your standard is greater… you will fall with your father the accuser!
So again, beware if you judge another… you reap what you sow, and that will be judgment upon yourself.
I heard a saying recently, it went like this.
If you throw a rock at a pack of dogs, the one who yelps is the one you hit… think about that before you respond and try to justify your judgmentalism and condemnation.
Under His Blood… a beloved of Christ,
iggy
I have been battling a cold for about 2 weeks, which is funny as it seems every time I have someone start telling me I am a heretic or worse, (in love of course) I seem to come down with some sort of cold or flu right as it starts… it seems to set me into a very grumpy mood as I try to respond and not react to some of the nonsense that is thrown at me. The funny thing is many of these so called defenders of truth may actually be able to communicate with me and I might see something different if they approached me in a different way…
And that is also true in how we must approach those who are lost. How and why do we think anyone will listen to the “Good News” with all the added garbage… the doctrines that defend judgmentalism? Even Jesus did not come to judge, but to save us! (John 12:46-50)
Yet, some seem to be higher than Jesus and deem themselves worthy of being a judge over other men… which is anathema to the teachings of the bible… and of Christ Jesus! (Rom 14:4)
In there is a way that is biblical in how we judge the world and that is to walk in love… as we do this without fault and love God, then the world and the Satanic powers have no where to stand but in judgment as we deem God worthy of our love. So it is in Love we judge, not by some standard of righteousness we create. It is only as we stand in the righteousness of Christ, Who is worthy that we with Him please the Father.
In that when Christ returns then HE WILL JUDGE ALL by His righteousness and that being THE STANDARD. For some to stand on their own on that day is a sad thing indeed. Even worse is to stand in judgment now, as if you are Christ Himself… some sort of pseudo Christ, that deems his own righteousness as the standard… beware if you stand there as this is holding one’s own righteousness as equal with Jesus’…
This is true and if one does not see it they are blind…
Luke 6: 35. But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. 36. Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful. 37. "Do not judge and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven. NIV
Yet, some come to this blog as a so called brother and attack and condemn me in a way that even Christ Himself never did to a sinner, let alone one He called his own. In doing this you condemn yourself… not me… or anyone else.
You see you are usurping the authority of Christ as you stand as an accuser of the brethren, and with that you are standing not with Christ but with Satan for that is his nature and what he has done from the beginning… and that is his title… the accuser of the brethren. If you question this, then read in Rev 12: 9. The great dragon was hurled down--that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.
10. Then I heard a loud voice in heaven say: "Now have come the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God, and the authority of his Christ. For the accuser of our brothers, who accuses them before our God day and night, has been hurled down.
11. They overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony; they did not love their lives so much as to shrink from death. NIV
So, do you still want to stand in judgment? Then go ahead, and that is your fate. Do you still want to justify yourself by thinking your standard is greater… you will fall with your father the accuser!
So again, beware if you judge another… you reap what you sow, and that will be judgment upon yourself.
I heard a saying recently, it went like this.
If you throw a rock at a pack of dogs, the one who yelps is the one you hit… think about that before you respond and try to justify your judgmentalism and condemnation.
Under His Blood… a beloved of Christ,
iggy
Wednesday, June 28, 2006
CHRIST HIMSELF THE CONTENT OF CHRISTIAN FAITH
By: Major W. Ian Thomas
There is something, which makes Christianity more than a religion, more than an ethic, and more than the idle dream of the sentimental idealist. It is this something, which makes it relevant to each one of us right now as a contemporary experience. It is the fact that Christ Himself is the very life content of the Christian faith. It is He who makes it "tick." "Faithful is he that calleth you, who also will do it" (I Thessalonians 5:24). The One who calls you is the One who does that to which He calls you. "For it is God which worketh in you, both to will and to do of His good pleasure" (Philippians 2:13). He is Himself the very dynamic of all His demands.
Christ did not die simply that you might be saved from a bad conscience, or even to remove the stain of past failure, but to "clear the decks" for divine action. You have been told that Christ died to save you. This is gloriously true in a very limited, though vital sense. In Romans 5:10 we read, "If, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life." The Lord Jesus Christ therefore ministers to you in two distinct ways - He reconciles you to God by His death, and He saves you by His life.
Christ did not die simply that you might be saved from a bad conscience, or even to remove the stain of past failure, but to "clear the decks" for divine action. You have been told that Christ died to save you. This is gloriously true in a very limited, though vital sense. In Romans 5:10 we read, "If, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life." The Lord Jesus Christ therefore ministers to you in two distinct ways - He reconciles you to God by His death, and He saves you by His life.
This, however, is but the beginning of the story, "for if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, (now an accomplished fact,) we shall be saved (as a continuing process) by His life" (Romans 5:10). The glorious fact of the matter is this no sooner has God reconciled to Himself the man who has responded to His call, than He re-imparts to him, as a forgiven sinner, the presence of the Holy Spirit, and this restoration to him of the Holy Spirit constitutes what the Bible calls regeneration, or new birth. Titus 3:5 and 6, "Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and the renewing of the Holy Ghost; which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour."
From: The Saving Life of Christ, Grand Rapids: Zondervan Publishing House. ©1961.
Friday, June 23, 2006
This just cracks me up!!
This just cracks me up!
I have been reading a comic called “Get Fuzzy”.
In this a guy named Rob has a cat named Bucky Katt … who thinks he is smarter than Rob and Satchel the dog. Meet the characters here.
What has been cracking me up is the last few strips have been about England and that Fuzzy does not think it exists…
Now, I think I relate to it from Rob’s perspective… how do I get this cat to understand the Truth (LOL!)
Yet, I bet many of you will think I am more… Bucky Katt. LOL!
I have been reading a comic called “Get Fuzzy”.
In this a guy named Rob has a cat named Bucky Katt … who thinks he is smarter than Rob and Satchel the dog. Meet the characters here.
What has been cracking me up is the last few strips have been about England and that Fuzzy does not think it exists…
Now, I think I relate to it from Rob’s perspective… how do I get this cat to understand the Truth (LOL!)
Yet, I bet many of you will think I am more… Bucky Katt. LOL!
Wednesday, June 21, 2006
More on the last topic
More on the last topic
I found this interesting articles… some are not even PM/E/e and are saying basically what I have been preaching here.
No Room for Personal Truth By Dr. Bruce Prescott
Another thought is that of why is propositional truth need to be so cold and objective? It seems to run contrary to the Creeds of the faith let alone the Truth of the Incarnation. These versions are all taken from Creeds of Christendom
The "Rule of Faith" as recorded by Irenaeus:
. . . this faith: in one God, the Father Almighty, who made the heaven and the earth and the seas and all the things that are in them; and in one Christ Jesus, the Son of God, who was made flesh for our salvation; and in the Holy Spirit, who made known through the prophets the plan of salvation, and the coming, and the birth from a virgin, and the passion, and the resurrection from the dead, and the bodily ascension into heaven of the beloved Christ Jesus, our Lord, and his future appearing from heaven in the glory of the Father to sum up all things and to raise anew all flesh of the whole human race . . .
The Nicene Creed
We believe in one God the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.
And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all worlds, God of God, Light of Light, Very God of Very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father by whom all things were made; who for us men, and for our salvation, came down from heaven, and was incarnate by the Holy Spirit of the Virgin Mary, and was made man, and was crucified also for us under Pontius Pilate. He suffered and was buried, and the third day he rose again according to the Scriptures, and ascended into heaven, and sitteth on the right hand of the Father. And he shall come again with glory to judge both the quick and the dead, whose kingdom shall have no end.
And we believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord and Giver of Life, who proceedeth from the Father and the Son, who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified, who spoke by the prophets. And we believe one holy catholic and apostolic Church. We acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins. And we look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come. Amen.
The Apostles' Creed
I believe in God the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth.
And in Jesus Christ his only Son our Lord; who was conceived by the Holy Ghost, born of the Virgin Mary, suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, dead, and buried; he descended into hell; the third day he rose again from the dead; he ascended into heaven, and sitteth on the right hand of God the Father Almighty; from thence he shall come to judge the quick and the dead.
I believe in the Holy Ghost; the holy catholic Church; the communion of saints; the forgiveness of sins; the resurrection of the body; and the life everlasting. AMEN.
Of course The Apostle John had this to say. 1 John 1:1. That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked at and our hands have touched--this we proclaim concerning the Word of life. 2. The life appeared; we have seen it and testify to it, and we proclaim to you the eternal life, which was with the Father and has appeared to us. 3. We proclaim to you what we have seen and heard, so that you also may have fellowship with us. And our fellowship is with the Father and with his Son, Jesus Christ. NIV
I see that at least for me that Truth must be found in the Person of Christ, and only to be possessed when that life indwells us.
Blessings,
iggy
I found this interesting articles… some are not even PM/E/e and are saying basically what I have been preaching here.
No Room for Personal Truth By Dr. Bruce Prescott
Another thought is that of why is propositional truth need to be so cold and objective? It seems to run contrary to the Creeds of the faith let alone the Truth of the Incarnation. These versions are all taken from Creeds of Christendom
The "Rule of Faith" as recorded by Irenaeus:
. . . this faith: in one God, the Father Almighty, who made the heaven and the earth and the seas and all the things that are in them; and in one Christ Jesus, the Son of God, who was made flesh for our salvation; and in the Holy Spirit, who made known through the prophets the plan of salvation, and the coming, and the birth from a virgin, and the passion, and the resurrection from the dead, and the bodily ascension into heaven of the beloved Christ Jesus, our Lord, and his future appearing from heaven in the glory of the Father to sum up all things and to raise anew all flesh of the whole human race . . .
The Nicene Creed
We believe in one God the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.
And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all worlds, God of God, Light of Light, Very God of Very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father by whom all things were made; who for us men, and for our salvation, came down from heaven, and was incarnate by the Holy Spirit of the Virgin Mary, and was made man, and was crucified also for us under Pontius Pilate. He suffered and was buried, and the third day he rose again according to the Scriptures, and ascended into heaven, and sitteth on the right hand of the Father. And he shall come again with glory to judge both the quick and the dead, whose kingdom shall have no end.
And we believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord and Giver of Life, who proceedeth from the Father and the Son, who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified, who spoke by the prophets. And we believe one holy catholic and apostolic Church. We acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins. And we look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come. Amen.
The Apostles' Creed
I believe in God the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth.
And in Jesus Christ his only Son our Lord; who was conceived by the Holy Ghost, born of the Virgin Mary, suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, dead, and buried; he descended into hell; the third day he rose again from the dead; he ascended into heaven, and sitteth on the right hand of God the Father Almighty; from thence he shall come to judge the quick and the dead.
I believe in the Holy Ghost; the holy catholic Church; the communion of saints; the forgiveness of sins; the resurrection of the body; and the life everlasting. AMEN.
Of course The Apostle John had this to say. 1 John 1:1. That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked at and our hands have touched--this we proclaim concerning the Word of life. 2. The life appeared; we have seen it and testify to it, and we proclaim to you the eternal life, which was with the Father and has appeared to us. 3. We proclaim to you what we have seen and heard, so that you also may have fellowship with us. And our fellowship is with the Father and with his Son, Jesus Christ. NIV
I see that at least for me that Truth must be found in the Person of Christ, and only to be possessed when that life indwells us.
Blessings,
iggy
Tuesday, June 20, 2006
What is your faith built on? Incarnational Truth vs. Propositional Truth pt 2
What is your faith built on? Incarnational Truth vs. Propositional Truth
Ok, I am getting braced for the assault! LOL!
I found this phrase with John O’Keefe on his discussion group and think it is very much the same as I have been saying.
Is your faith built on the Bible and that being a group of Propositional truths grouped together?
Or is your faith built on the Incarnation?
Do you find Jesus in the Bible?
Or is the Bible your source of truth?
I see that Jesus is God, and this God was revealed throughout scripture… and as the bible points out (in red no less!), all scriptures points to Jesus!
Luke 24: 25. He said to them, "How foolish you are, and how slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken!
26. Did not the Christ have to suffer these things and then enter his glory?"
27. And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he explained to them what was said in all the Scriptures concerning himself.
Then this Person, meaning Jesus being God incarnate… is Truth incarnate.
I see that the Bible is more than a group of propositional truths grouped together. I have built my faith first on the foundation of Christ… I filter my Truth revealed by Jesus through the Bible to match what has already been revealed and reason it out with Jesus (Who is alive!) as to how this revealed truth works out in my life. I do not live my life by the book so to say, but by the Life of Christ and then backed up by the bible…
The issue is many try to find life in the Bible… and He is there, yet just like the Pharisees of old they search and search and try to find life from the scriptures… Jesus had this to say!!!!
John 5: 37. And the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me. You have never heard his voice nor seen his form, 38. nor does his word dwell in you, for you do not believe the one he sent. 39. You diligently study the Scriptures because you think that by them you possess eternal life. These are the Scriptures that testify about me, 40. yet you refuse to come to me to have life.
Notice that Jesus says that the Father’s word does not dwell in them? If the word does not dwell in them then they could not understand! Yet it because they did not believe the one the Father had sent… meaning Jesus. We need to first come to Christ (vs. 39) to have the Life… then as He dwells in us, we can then understand the scriptures and how they testify about Jesus.
It was after the resurrection of Jesus… and His revealing of Who He was and is… that the Scripture made sense.
John 2: 22. After he was raised from the dead, his disciples recalled what he had said. Then they believed the Scripture and the words that Jesus had spoken.
So, again I can not say I see the bible as a group of propositional truths that I am to live by as I see that scripture itself testifies that I am to live by the Life of Christ… in that I then can understand and grow in the knowledge of Grace and Truth.
Blessings,
iggy
Ok, I am getting braced for the assault! LOL!
I found this phrase with John O’Keefe on his discussion group and think it is very much the same as I have been saying.
Is your faith built on the Bible and that being a group of Propositional truths grouped together?
Or is your faith built on the Incarnation?
Do you find Jesus in the Bible?
Or is the Bible your source of truth?
I see that Jesus is God, and this God was revealed throughout scripture… and as the bible points out (in red no less!), all scriptures points to Jesus!
Luke 24: 25. He said to them, "How foolish you are, and how slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken!
26. Did not the Christ have to suffer these things and then enter his glory?"
27. And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he explained to them what was said in all the Scriptures concerning himself.
Then this Person, meaning Jesus being God incarnate… is Truth incarnate.
I see that the Bible is more than a group of propositional truths grouped together. I have built my faith first on the foundation of Christ… I filter my Truth revealed by Jesus through the Bible to match what has already been revealed and reason it out with Jesus (Who is alive!) as to how this revealed truth works out in my life. I do not live my life by the book so to say, but by the Life of Christ and then backed up by the bible…
The issue is many try to find life in the Bible… and He is there, yet just like the Pharisees of old they search and search and try to find life from the scriptures… Jesus had this to say!!!!
John 5: 37. And the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me. You have never heard his voice nor seen his form, 38. nor does his word dwell in you, for you do not believe the one he sent. 39. You diligently study the Scriptures because you think that by them you possess eternal life. These are the Scriptures that testify about me, 40. yet you refuse to come to me to have life.
Notice that Jesus says that the Father’s word does not dwell in them? If the word does not dwell in them then they could not understand! Yet it because they did not believe the one the Father had sent… meaning Jesus. We need to first come to Christ (vs. 39) to have the Life… then as He dwells in us, we can then understand the scriptures and how they testify about Jesus.
It was after the resurrection of Jesus… and His revealing of Who He was and is… that the Scripture made sense.
John 2: 22. After he was raised from the dead, his disciples recalled what he had said. Then they believed the Scripture and the words that Jesus had spoken.
So, again I can not say I see the bible as a group of propositional truths that I am to live by as I see that scripture itself testifies that I am to live by the Life of Christ… in that I then can understand and grow in the knowledge of Grace and Truth.
Blessings,
iggy
I Have Been Pondering Something
I have been pondering something.
This year or at least the last couple of months I have had some people who disagree with me on what I have written… or rather what they presupposed me to have written.
Let me explain:
I have no problem with someone disagreeing with me. In fact I find it a great opportunity for myself and the other person to get to know each other, and talk it out. I have found God works out the “disagreement”. Often it is not that we disagree, but only that we are standing at either end of the topic. And with that it can take time to see that we agree but express it differently.
Sometimes in the course of conversing my mind may change, and though I don't go back and change the post, if one follows the conversation they will see, out of the conversation, development out of the original post. Does that make sense?
I am first to acknowledge that I often do not respond and often react. In that please remember I am only human! LOL! Really I have come a long way from where I was.
My issue is with those who come not to converse and discuss a ‘disagreement’ but rather come with the idea that they are all right and I am all wrong… just because they see “PM/E/e” somewhere. It seems to not matter at that point what I say. I am an apostate to them in my association as an “emerging”.
To me their argument is like this.
“I have just read, Nevada has recently declared it illegal to let your child sit on your lap while you drive. The law now states that for the child’s safety, the child must be restraint in a car seat in case of an accident. Though I love my child and love to let them sit on my lap I see that it should be illegal to let your child sit on your lap in the car while driving in any state.”
Now, I have found that if I said that the accusation from someone would be. “That iggy just said that he supports the state to not allow children to sit on their parents lap.”
Then quote me like this:
“Though I love my child and love to let them sit on my lap I see that it should be illegal to let your child sit on your lap.”
Which I did say, but it is then taken and put into a new context and then twisted to mean something I never said at all… then I say, “I never said that, I said, “Though I love my child and love to let them sit on my lap I see that it should be illegal to let your child sit on your lap in the car while driving in any state.” Which is replied with, “You are a lair!”
I agree that in the “new context” that was created, that I am then a lair… but not in the original context. LOL!
The next thing I found is that the argument is then around me being a lair or not! Here are some reasons for that. I think there is much wisdom here.
I found this article in which Brian McLaren points out some reasons this happens.
I will just give an excerpt here I really recommend reading the whole interview:
“Darren King: It is no secret that you have your fair share of critics. I think many of us realize that your critics often misrepresent you and your beliefs. I'm wondering if you could offer some insight as to why and how this misrepresentation takes place? How can those of us within the conversation be on guard against doing the same thing to others?
Brian McLaren: It's great you ask that last question, because I'd be more sad to see those of us who share this connection to respond inappropriately than I would to see the unfair criticism increase. As I said earlier, this is a real temptation that I and many face right now. I hope people will pray for me, and for all of us. Even if we avoid being overtly defensive or aggressive, it's too easy to become passive aggressive or to let the jabs come out in some sideways fashion. Lord, have mercy.I also think you're wise to ask why so much of the criticism is so inaccurate. It's good to try to understand the causes of things like this - and not just react. Let me do a brain dump of some of the reasons that come to mind, in no particular order. And it's important to say that I don't present these as diagnoses of any particular individual - just as general possibilities. And we're not talking about legitimate questions and dialogue, even vigorous debate: we're talking about the mean-spirited stuff that causes critics to make wild statements that even their friends would say are over the top.
1. Sometimes, I or others have not spoken charitably or wisely enough, and people have felt criticized or attacked, so they have responded with counterattack. In these cases, I am reaping bad fruit from sowing bad seed, and the pain of their unfairness can lead me to repent for any times I'm unfair.
2. Many religious communities feel under threat. Their numbers are declining. Their young people are leaving. Money is down. When any individual or organization feels threatened, it's easy to become testy, grouchy, or mean-spirited.
3. These stressed communities might love us if we offered the three easy steps to keeping their young people, or to bringing in lots of the unchurched. But when they listen to us, we tell them we don't think there are three easy steps. We tell them needed change will require deep rethinking and hard work and some pain. Some of them don't want to hear this, so there's probably a reaction to complexity and unwanted news that causes pain and creates a pained response.
4. Many of these folks, I think, have been trained unconsciously to work by fear. Fear (along with guilt) is a primary means of motivation in many religious communities - the fear of being rejected, corrected, looked down upon, or called "liberal" or some other epithet. It's weird to see "emergent" now become an epithet for these folks! When some of their young people - maybe their sons and daughters - are attracted to what we're doing, they understandably wish they would stay "in the fold," so to speak. So, they attack a few of us to make their flock be afraid of associating with us. It's a survival thing, I guess. In that case, the criticism is not even aimed at us: it's aimed at those in their fold who might leave or question things or work for change.
5. Many of the harshest critics come from fundamentalist religious traditions where hot and inaccurate rhetoric is acceptable whenever doctrinal matters are in play. That's just the way certain kinds of fundamentlists do business, and they have done so for centuries - Christian, Muslim, Hindu, Jewish, whatever. They've been trained in it, almost as a form of discipleship. They may even enjoy it, like an art form or sport. And they feel they are serving God when they do it, so it gets passed on from generation to generation. You can't blame people for this, since it's almost instinctual.
6. Some critics are playing to their constituency. They aren't trying to educate or correct us. After all, if they wanted to be heard, they're smart enough to know they should take more care to be accurate and charitable. But they're writing to show their strength and boldness and maybe their rhetorical cleverness to their community, proving themselves to others, or perhaps to themselves.
7. Some of them have never read or listened to us, but are reacting based on hearsay. So, they believe what they were told, and they're passing it on, since they trust the people who told them.
8. Some of it is just plain old sin, but sin of a particularly religious sort. Some famous person once said, "For bad people to do bad things, you just need an opportunity. For good people to do bad things, you need religion."
9. Some people are probably acting out of sociological or psychological scripts they don't even understand.
10. More significant than any of the previous possibilities though, there's some work in "systems-sensitive leadership" that I've found very helpful. The main book (of that title) is out of print and unavailable, but the idea is that people think and behave in the context of thinking systems. At certain levels - there are eight levels in the book I'm thinking of - people respond to perceived threat or disturbance with physical violence. At higher levels, the violence progresses to verbal, and eventually, of course, moves beyond violence altogether. Back in the Inquisition era, and even in the Reformation era, there was a lot of physical violence in response to doctrinal differences. So it's progress if the worst we get is some name-calling! And if we can respond with grace and good humor, perhaps we'll help our religious communities to move to some higher levels.”
Again, I have no issue if someone disagrees with me. If one looks at the links I have one will find people who regularly do not agree with me! Like Dan Carter, who in the course of discussion on our disagreements I have found to be very generous and Gracious.
I heard a quote which I am not sure where it came from, but it goes something like this.
“If two people agree totally on every point on everything, one of them is not necessary.” With that my dear brothers and sisters in Christ, I do believe you all necessary for Christ Himself found value in you, enough to die for you, and then to rise again and give you Life Eternal!
Blessings,
iggy
This year or at least the last couple of months I have had some people who disagree with me on what I have written… or rather what they presupposed me to have written.
Let me explain:
I have no problem with someone disagreeing with me. In fact I find it a great opportunity for myself and the other person to get to know each other, and talk it out. I have found God works out the “disagreement”. Often it is not that we disagree, but only that we are standing at either end of the topic. And with that it can take time to see that we agree but express it differently.
Sometimes in the course of conversing my mind may change, and though I don't go back and change the post, if one follows the conversation they will see, out of the conversation, development out of the original post. Does that make sense?
I am first to acknowledge that I often do not respond and often react. In that please remember I am only human! LOL! Really I have come a long way from where I was.
My issue is with those who come not to converse and discuss a ‘disagreement’ but rather come with the idea that they are all right and I am all wrong… just because they see “PM/E/e” somewhere. It seems to not matter at that point what I say. I am an apostate to them in my association as an “emerging”.
To me their argument is like this.
“I have just read, Nevada has recently declared it illegal to let your child sit on your lap while you drive. The law now states that for the child’s safety, the child must be restraint in a car seat in case of an accident. Though I love my child and love to let them sit on my lap I see that it should be illegal to let your child sit on your lap in the car while driving in any state.”
Now, I have found that if I said that the accusation from someone would be. “That iggy just said that he supports the state to not allow children to sit on their parents lap.”
Then quote me like this:
“Though I love my child and love to let them sit on my lap I see that it should be illegal to let your child sit on your lap.”
Which I did say, but it is then taken and put into a new context and then twisted to mean something I never said at all… then I say, “I never said that, I said, “Though I love my child and love to let them sit on my lap I see that it should be illegal to let your child sit on your lap in the car while driving in any state.” Which is replied with, “You are a lair!”
I agree that in the “new context” that was created, that I am then a lair… but not in the original context. LOL!
The next thing I found is that the argument is then around me being a lair or not! Here are some reasons for that. I think there is much wisdom here.
I found this article in which Brian McLaren points out some reasons this happens.
I will just give an excerpt here I really recommend reading the whole interview:
“Darren King: It is no secret that you have your fair share of critics. I think many of us realize that your critics often misrepresent you and your beliefs. I'm wondering if you could offer some insight as to why and how this misrepresentation takes place? How can those of us within the conversation be on guard against doing the same thing to others?
Brian McLaren: It's great you ask that last question, because I'd be more sad to see those of us who share this connection to respond inappropriately than I would to see the unfair criticism increase. As I said earlier, this is a real temptation that I and many face right now. I hope people will pray for me, and for all of us. Even if we avoid being overtly defensive or aggressive, it's too easy to become passive aggressive or to let the jabs come out in some sideways fashion. Lord, have mercy.I also think you're wise to ask why so much of the criticism is so inaccurate. It's good to try to understand the causes of things like this - and not just react. Let me do a brain dump of some of the reasons that come to mind, in no particular order. And it's important to say that I don't present these as diagnoses of any particular individual - just as general possibilities. And we're not talking about legitimate questions and dialogue, even vigorous debate: we're talking about the mean-spirited stuff that causes critics to make wild statements that even their friends would say are over the top.
1. Sometimes, I or others have not spoken charitably or wisely enough, and people have felt criticized or attacked, so they have responded with counterattack. In these cases, I am reaping bad fruit from sowing bad seed, and the pain of their unfairness can lead me to repent for any times I'm unfair.
2. Many religious communities feel under threat. Their numbers are declining. Their young people are leaving. Money is down. When any individual or organization feels threatened, it's easy to become testy, grouchy, or mean-spirited.
3. These stressed communities might love us if we offered the three easy steps to keeping their young people, or to bringing in lots of the unchurched. But when they listen to us, we tell them we don't think there are three easy steps. We tell them needed change will require deep rethinking and hard work and some pain. Some of them don't want to hear this, so there's probably a reaction to complexity and unwanted news that causes pain and creates a pained response.
4. Many of these folks, I think, have been trained unconsciously to work by fear. Fear (along with guilt) is a primary means of motivation in many religious communities - the fear of being rejected, corrected, looked down upon, or called "liberal" or some other epithet. It's weird to see "emergent" now become an epithet for these folks! When some of their young people - maybe their sons and daughters - are attracted to what we're doing, they understandably wish they would stay "in the fold," so to speak. So, they attack a few of us to make their flock be afraid of associating with us. It's a survival thing, I guess. In that case, the criticism is not even aimed at us: it's aimed at those in their fold who might leave or question things or work for change.
5. Many of the harshest critics come from fundamentalist religious traditions where hot and inaccurate rhetoric is acceptable whenever doctrinal matters are in play. That's just the way certain kinds of fundamentlists do business, and they have done so for centuries - Christian, Muslim, Hindu, Jewish, whatever. They've been trained in it, almost as a form of discipleship. They may even enjoy it, like an art form or sport. And they feel they are serving God when they do it, so it gets passed on from generation to generation. You can't blame people for this, since it's almost instinctual.
6. Some critics are playing to their constituency. They aren't trying to educate or correct us. After all, if they wanted to be heard, they're smart enough to know they should take more care to be accurate and charitable. But they're writing to show their strength and boldness and maybe their rhetorical cleverness to their community, proving themselves to others, or perhaps to themselves.
7. Some of them have never read or listened to us, but are reacting based on hearsay. So, they believe what they were told, and they're passing it on, since they trust the people who told them.
8. Some of it is just plain old sin, but sin of a particularly religious sort. Some famous person once said, "For bad people to do bad things, you just need an opportunity. For good people to do bad things, you need religion."
9. Some people are probably acting out of sociological or psychological scripts they don't even understand.
10. More significant than any of the previous possibilities though, there's some work in "systems-sensitive leadership" that I've found very helpful. The main book (of that title) is out of print and unavailable, but the idea is that people think and behave in the context of thinking systems. At certain levels - there are eight levels in the book I'm thinking of - people respond to perceived threat or disturbance with physical violence. At higher levels, the violence progresses to verbal, and eventually, of course, moves beyond violence altogether. Back in the Inquisition era, and even in the Reformation era, there was a lot of physical violence in response to doctrinal differences. So it's progress if the worst we get is some name-calling! And if we can respond with grace and good humor, perhaps we'll help our religious communities to move to some higher levels.”
Again, I have no issue if someone disagrees with me. If one looks at the links I have one will find people who regularly do not agree with me! Like Dan Carter, who in the course of discussion on our disagreements I have found to be very generous and Gracious.
I heard a quote which I am not sure where it came from, but it goes something like this.
“If two people agree totally on every point on everything, one of them is not necessary.” With that my dear brothers and sisters in Christ, I do believe you all necessary for Christ Himself found value in you, enough to die for you, and then to rise again and give you Life Eternal!
Blessings,
iggy
Sunday, June 18, 2006
I found this interview interesting!!
I found this interview via, faithmaps.com
http://pastortad.blogspot.com/2006/05/drfrank-page-answers-questions-for-sbc.html
This guy gets it!!
Dr. Frank Page: “I see many valuable contributions to the SBC coming from the Emergent Leaders Movement. I believe it is a positive thing to see a broader number of participants in our convention’s direction. I personally applaud this movement. I do want to speak a word of caution about a harmful message that possibly could come from the movement. As our convention seems to be breaking into a multitude of disparate groups, there is the possibility of an entitlement mentality coming forth. As I will say over and over, this convention does not belong to any one group. We are at the table by God’s grace and mercy. We must be very careful to feel that any of us are entitled to any power or influence at all.”
Blessings,
iggy
Wednesday, June 14, 2006
Born Free Presentation
This presentation would be what I wouldconsider the “foundation” of my belief structure.
Please view this link.
Born Free Presentation
Blessings,
iggy
Please view this link.
Born Free Presentation
Blessings,
iggy
A Question About My Blog Links
A Question About My Blog Links.
Miss Sara had asked me what links on this blog reflect emerging thought. I thought it easier to just post this than to use the comments.
Sara,
Sorry, I did not catch part of your question... but no not all I have linked to are, or of emerging thought. Many might even be against it... but the links below will give you a good overview of some radical and some more conserviative side of emerging thought... I would say i am conserviative radical... LOL!
Like I said, most are friends. Like Levi (emergent)
Punk monkey (emergent)
Some are from the Church of God as I find of interest that they are debating about a new reformation. This is part of what I believe... I do not see that The Reformation ended... or has come to pass... but i see it as something that must and should be the duty of a Believer of Christ to consider... what the “sound doctrine is “over” man made". What part of doctrine comes from tradition or just ones preference... such as CoG's position being debated on instruments used in worship.
Some might even be opposed to the emerging thought… I will not speculate on whom.
I have a link of Irenaeus on Free Will that talks about free will… I am not a Calvinist, nor Armenian.. Yet, I believe in eternal security, and free will. I will save Calvinism and Armenianism’s short comings for another time.
People to People teach Grace… I have a link to them to listen to Bob George. Also I have a link to their “Born Free Presentation” which is a pretty good straight forward presentation for salvation. Again, I love Bob George yet I would not agree on all points… He teaches the exchanged Life… as well as Major Ian Thomas.
For the most part again the rest are friends or other ministries of interest to me… also I have an online Christian Radio station that helps indie Christian artist get airplay. But this is the list I would say would give you some insight to emerging thought. If you have any other questions please ask.
Blessings,
iggy
Miss Sara had asked me what links on this blog reflect emerging thought. I thought it easier to just post this than to use the comments.
Sara,
Sorry, I did not catch part of your question... but no not all I have linked to are, or of emerging thought. Many might even be against it... but the links below will give you a good overview of some radical and some more conserviative side of emerging thought... I would say i am conserviative radical... LOL!
Like I said, most are friends. Like Levi (emergent)
Punk monkey (emergent)
Some are from the Church of God as I find of interest that they are debating about a new reformation. This is part of what I believe... I do not see that The Reformation ended... or has come to pass... but i see it as something that must and should be the duty of a Believer of Christ to consider... what the “sound doctrine is “over” man made". What part of doctrine comes from tradition or just ones preference... such as CoG's position being debated on instruments used in worship.
Some might even be opposed to the emerging thought… I will not speculate on whom.
I have a link of Irenaeus on Free Will that talks about free will… I am not a Calvinist, nor Armenian.. Yet, I believe in eternal security, and free will. I will save Calvinism and Armenianism’s short comings for another time.
People to People teach Grace… I have a link to them to listen to Bob George. Also I have a link to their “Born Free Presentation” which is a pretty good straight forward presentation for salvation. Again, I love Bob George yet I would not agree on all points… He teaches the exchanged Life… as well as Major Ian Thomas.
- A Different Perspective
- A New Kind Of Conversation
- Big Pappa
- Brian McLaren
- bob.blog
- emergesque
- Emerging Grace
- futurechurch
- Jason Clark
- Jordan Cooper
- Leonard Sweet
- Levi
- nextChurch
- next Church blog
- Papa's House Blog
- Postmodern Theology
- praxis scripture study
- Punk Monkey
- TallSkinnyKiwi
- The Next Wave
- Ginkworld
- Greg Boyd and Open Theism
- Relevant Magazine
- The Ooze
For the most part again the rest are friends or other ministries of interest to me… also I have an online Christian Radio station that helps indie Christian artist get airplay. But this is the list I would say would give you some insight to emerging thought. If you have any other questions please ask.
Blessings,
iggy
Sad to have to do this.
I have decided that only those who are registered with Blogger can post on my blog. This is to put an end to abusers as they can be reported.
I wish that I did not have to do this...
So yes, I did cut Ben off, but please feel free to register and return Ben, and begin your diatribe of abuse some more... But be warned I will report it for what it is.
If you decide to actually converse without your continued lying and false accusations I will allow you to continue but I will not tollerate abuse not give you a forum to abuse me or others.
Blessings all in Christ,
iggy
I wish that I did not have to do this...
So yes, I did cut Ben off, but please feel free to register and return Ben, and begin your diatribe of abuse some more... But be warned I will report it for what it is.
If you decide to actually converse without your continued lying and false accusations I will allow you to continue but I will not tollerate abuse not give you a forum to abuse me or others.
Blessings all in Christ,
iggy
Sunday, June 11, 2006
THE BRICK
THE BRICK
I received this in my email…I do not know where it originated nor if it is a true story, yet I think it as inspirational.
Blessings,
iggy
THE BRICK
A young and successful executive was traveling down a neighborhood street, going a bit too fast in his new Jaguar. He was watching for kids darting out from between parked cars and slowed down when he thought he saw something. As his car passed, no children appeared. Instead, a brick smashed into the Jag's side door! He slammed on the brakes and backed the Jag back to the spot where the brick had been thrown.
The angry driver then jumped out of the car, grabbed the nearest kid and pushed him up against a parked car shouting, "What was that all about and who are you? Just what the heck are you doing? That's a new car and that brick you threw is going to cost a lot of money. Why did you do it?" The young boy was apologetic. "Please, mister...please, I'm sorry but I didn't know what else to do," He pleaded. "I threw the brick because no one else would stop..." With tears dripping down his face and off his chin, the youth pointed to a spot just around a parked car. "It's my brother, "he said "He rolled off the curb and fell out of his wheelchair and I can't lift him up."
Now sobbing, the boy asked the stunned executive, "Would you please help me get him back into his wheelchair? He's hurt and he's too heavy for me."
Moved beyond words, the driver tried to swallow the rapidly swelling lump in his throat. He hurriedly lifted the handicapped boy back into the wheelchair, then took out a linen handkerchief and dabbed at the fresh scrapes and cuts. A quick look told him everything was going to be okay. "Thank you and may God bless you," the grateful child told the stranger. Too shook up for words, the man simply watched the boy! push his wheelchair-bound brother down the sidewalk toward their home.
It was a long, slow walk back to the Jaguar. The damage was very noticeable, but the driver never bothered to repair the dented side door. He kept the dent there to remind him of this message: "Don't go through life so fast that someone has to throw a brick at you to get your attention!" God whispers in our souls and speaks to our hearts. Sometimes when we don't have time to listen, He has to throw a brick at us. It's our choice to listen or not.
I received this in my email…I do not know where it originated nor if it is a true story, yet I think it as inspirational.
Blessings,
iggy
THE BRICK
A young and successful executive was traveling down a neighborhood street, going a bit too fast in his new Jaguar. He was watching for kids darting out from between parked cars and slowed down when he thought he saw something. As his car passed, no children appeared. Instead, a brick smashed into the Jag's side door! He slammed on the brakes and backed the Jag back to the spot where the brick had been thrown.
The angry driver then jumped out of the car, grabbed the nearest kid and pushed him up against a parked car shouting, "What was that all about and who are you? Just what the heck are you doing? That's a new car and that brick you threw is going to cost a lot of money. Why did you do it?" The young boy was apologetic. "Please, mister...please, I'm sorry but I didn't know what else to do," He pleaded. "I threw the brick because no one else would stop..." With tears dripping down his face and off his chin, the youth pointed to a spot just around a parked car. "It's my brother, "he said "He rolled off the curb and fell out of his wheelchair and I can't lift him up."
Now sobbing, the boy asked the stunned executive, "Would you please help me get him back into his wheelchair? He's hurt and he's too heavy for me."
Moved beyond words, the driver tried to swallow the rapidly swelling lump in his throat. He hurriedly lifted the handicapped boy back into the wheelchair, then took out a linen handkerchief and dabbed at the fresh scrapes and cuts. A quick look told him everything was going to be okay. "Thank you and may God bless you," the grateful child told the stranger. Too shook up for words, the man simply watched the boy! push his wheelchair-bound brother down the sidewalk toward their home.
It was a long, slow walk back to the Jaguar. The damage was very noticeable, but the driver never bothered to repair the dented side door. He kept the dent there to remind him of this message: "Don't go through life so fast that someone has to throw a brick at you to get your attention!" God whispers in our souls and speaks to our hearts. Sometimes when we don't have time to listen, He has to throw a brick at us. It's our choice to listen or not.
Friday, June 09, 2006
I walk the balance between Heaven and Earth
“I walk the balance between Heaven and Earth
Sometimes I soar, often I slip - but I am never alone.
He caught me; reached all the way from sky to sea
He pulled me out of that ocean of hate, that enemy chaos,
the void in which I was drowning.”
Psalm 18 - The Message
Blessings,
iggy
Sometimes I soar, often I slip - but I am never alone.
He caught me; reached all the way from sky to sea
He pulled me out of that ocean of hate, that enemy chaos,
the void in which I was drowning.”
Psalm 18 - The Message
Blessings,
iggy
Monday, June 05, 2006
I have an affliction
I have an affliction
I suffer an affliction which I have written a bit in the past about. Not a physical one, which, yes I do have not one but many. Yet, this is one that rises up to alarm me and cause me some internal conflict.
I have never claimed to be educated, though I have spent much time reading and studying the scripture. I do not know Greek or Hebrew, yet I have a trusty Strong’s concordance and a basic understanding on how words are constructed. With these tools, God has shown me much.
My affliction is that I become tossed back and forth between the desire fro higher credentials, or even to have some or to remain as humbly uneducated as I am. In my mind I cross from trusting God completely and/or supplementing with more knowledge. Can God use both? YES! Yet, I also see many highly educated persons doing great things for God. Yet I also see many who have become puffed up with “knowledge” and though greatly blessed with education do not “understand”. One may say, “I know Greek.” Or “I know Hebrew.” And I say GREAT! Yet, the Pharisees did also! Some spoke to Jesus Himself and did not “understand”. So, Knowledge in itself can not bring understanding.
“Knowledge + experience” can bring clarity and bring one closer to “understanding”, yet, one can “experience” and “know” and still not understand. One can experience riding a motorcycle, but yet not understand “being a biker”. One can “experience the great outdoors”. Yet, that experience can be but a taste of the understanding, yet not give one open clarity to understanding the experience.
Many stood at the cross, believers, unbelievers, mockers of Jesus and lovers of Jesus! Yet, all stood with knowledge and experience as they witnessed the cross and Christ Crucified. Yet, even in that “Karios” moment, which would not only leave an imprint on all that were present, but also leave an imprint on time and eternity, they still lack understanding!
It was only after the Resurrection and only after Jesus had shown Himself to these and explained what the Resurrection meant, did the disciples gain “understanding”. How?
Through their relationship with Jesus Who revealed Himself to the disciples!
So, again, the affliction is to get more education, which there is nothing in itself wrong…. Or to continue to rest in the purity of Revelation that comes from my relationship with Jesus.
Blessings,
iggy
I suffer an affliction which I have written a bit in the past about. Not a physical one, which, yes I do have not one but many. Yet, this is one that rises up to alarm me and cause me some internal conflict.
I have never claimed to be educated, though I have spent much time reading and studying the scripture. I do not know Greek or Hebrew, yet I have a trusty Strong’s concordance and a basic understanding on how words are constructed. With these tools, God has shown me much.
My affliction is that I become tossed back and forth between the desire fro higher credentials, or even to have some or to remain as humbly uneducated as I am. In my mind I cross from trusting God completely and/or supplementing with more knowledge. Can God use both? YES! Yet, I also see many highly educated persons doing great things for God. Yet I also see many who have become puffed up with “knowledge” and though greatly blessed with education do not “understand”. One may say, “I know Greek.” Or “I know Hebrew.” And I say GREAT! Yet, the Pharisees did also! Some spoke to Jesus Himself and did not “understand”. So, Knowledge in itself can not bring understanding.
“Knowledge + experience” can bring clarity and bring one closer to “understanding”, yet, one can “experience” and “know” and still not understand. One can experience riding a motorcycle, but yet not understand “being a biker”. One can “experience the great outdoors”. Yet, that experience can be but a taste of the understanding, yet not give one open clarity to understanding the experience.
Many stood at the cross, believers, unbelievers, mockers of Jesus and lovers of Jesus! Yet, all stood with knowledge and experience as they witnessed the cross and Christ Crucified. Yet, even in that “Karios” moment, which would not only leave an imprint on all that were present, but also leave an imprint on time and eternity, they still lack understanding!
It was only after the Resurrection and only after Jesus had shown Himself to these and explained what the Resurrection meant, did the disciples gain “understanding”. How?
Through their relationship with Jesus Who revealed Himself to the disciples!
So, again, the affliction is to get more education, which there is nothing in itself wrong…. Or to continue to rest in the purity of Revelation that comes from my relationship with Jesus.
Blessings,
iggy
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